The Following Message Has Been Transcribed For
Clarity, Continuity Of Thought, And Punctuation By
The LEM Transcribing & Editing Team.
Walking in knee-high grass on a dirt track road. On the left side of the road was an opening between tall trees, hiding some of my view to a cared-for garden. I only could see huge, foot-size white blossom cups. The blossoms were a foot-high, and some of them were hanging low on the trees. After I passed this separate place, someone said to me (I did not know it was a man or a woman; it seemed like it was more a man) that I had this beautiful fragrance emitting from my person, from passing through that flowers.
Then I turned to the right, and also, that was on my left, so I do not know if that’s any significance.
But then I turned to the right and was in a covered, open stall with a washing machine in front of me. On my left was a woman that told me, as I looked at the machine, that I could put a clothespin in the hole on top of the machine, and it would not break the machine.
PASTOR VITALE: You put a clothespin in the coin hole?
Some hole. There was a hole in the top of the machine. And she said, “You can put the clothespin in there. It will not break the machine.”
But when I put it in, and I just could feel everything, all the machine, just grinding and grinding and it did not make any noise or anything, but my spirit felt it.
And that was it.
That was just the end of the machine, the end of the dream.
I was thinking about, you know, your soul being washed. I was trying to make heads and tail out of it.
PASTOR VITALE: The clothespin went into the washing machine?
Yeah, I put it in the machine. I did not want to, but she said, “Go ahead. It will not destroy it.” I put it in, and then I got this feeling that the thing was going to all break apart.
THE DREAM AND ITS INTERPRETATION
COMMENT: I was walking in knee-high grass on a dirt track road.
PASTOR VITALE: A dirt road, dirt refers to the soul realm because Adam was formed out of the dust of the ground. And dirt refers to the soul realm. Grass, we have a whole series on grass (LEM Message #33 (3 Parts) GRASS - A STUDY ON INCARNATION) where we learn that grass is a type of the life of God, which is growing in the earth of our soul or in the dirt of our soul. So the grass was up to your knees, which means that it was not an itty-bitty baby. We are talking about the life of Christ now; I do not know if I made that clear. The grass typifies the life of Christ that is being formed in us. It was not an itty-bitty baby like of Christ; it was already up to your knees. We do have some Scriptures in Ezekiel where it says the water is up to his ankle, and then it is up to his knees. So the life of God is growing in us. And up to your knees, it is not that far up, but it is a lot more than just getting started. So I would say, if you were walking in knee-high grass, that Christ is being formed in you, and it is up to your knees, which means you have some depth of maturity.
COMMENT: Now on the left side of the road, there was an opening between these tall trees and hid my view as to see. I know there was some sort of a garden. I felt somebody had cared for it in that section. And in the front part of it, I saw these white, cupped blossoms about a foot high. And I had the feeling of a lot of beauty as far as fragrance and the floral beauty.
PASTOR VITALE: Were they a part of the garden, the flowers?
PASTOR VITALE: They were a part of the garden?
PASTOR VITALE: So on your left, the left hand or the left side…
COMMENT: Well, part of the trees.
PASTOR VITALE: They were part of the trees.
COMMENT: Some of them were on the trees and hanging down on the trees somehow part of the trees.
PASTOR VITALE: The left hand typifies judgment in the Scripture. The right hand is the blessings, and the left hand is judgment. So you look to the judgment side of your walk. Of course, the dirt road also is talking about your walk, as you walk through this earth realm, and the life of Christ is growing in you. When you started to experience judgment, you looked up, and you saw, as a result of your judgment, that flowers were growing, OK, that there were trees, which typify men in the Scripture, and that there was a garden behind the trees. And the garden typifies the Garden of Eden, which is the soul realm of Christ, the life in the soul realm where perfect provision is.
And standing in front of it were trees that had flowers on them. And trees typify men, and flowers, in the Scripture, typify the anointing of the Holy Spirit or the imputed anointing. The imparted anointing is typified by fruit; the imputed anointing is typified by flowers. And I know you are a gardener, so that you know, when you are growing vegetables, that the flowers come up -- tomato plants in particular -- the flower comes up before the fruit. And then, when the fruit comes up, it destroys the flower. Amen.
So you saw, on your left side, as a result of judgment -- I do not know if it is as a result of judgment, but when you looked in the direction of judgment. I really guess I should not say as a result of judgment. When you looked in the direction of judgment, you saw trees or men upon which the Holy Spirit was appearing. And behind them was the Garden of Eden. So to get to the Garden of Eden, which is the full stature of Christ, you had to go through this Holy Spirit experience. Have you ever heard or read about people who claim they had an experience with the Lord, that the whole room filled up with the smell of beautiful flowers? That means the Holy Spirit was present. He is the flower of the Lord. OK.
And the fact that there was an opening could mean that an opening was made for you to go through. It would be an invitation for you to go through. And although I corrected myself before, I do not think you saw this as a result of judgment, but to pass through that opening would involve judgment, and that is why it was on your left. To get past the trees and to get past the Holy Spirit to the garden definitely involves judgment, and that is why it was on your left.
COMMENT: So I passed it. I kept going on the road, and after I came past this garden, then someone said to me that this beautiful fragrance was emitting from my person.
PASTOR VITALE: Somebody said it to you. OK, so that is a witness that the imputed anointing is operating in you. OK. And you were not a little flower that happened opened up yet, but you were a blossoming flower that was giving off a beautiful fragrance. So we know that the imputed anointing was operating in you with some maturity, with a large measure of maturity.
COMMENT: Then I turned to the right and was in a covered, open stall. And it contained a washing machine.
PASTOR VITALE: A covered, open stall that contained a washing machine. Well, we know that a washing machine refers to cleansing. And we know that, once we get the Holy Spirit, it is time to start getting cleansed or sanctified -- what that means is to separate Christ from Adam in our mind, and that can start with the imputed anointing because, with the imputed anointing, at least hopefully, you are reading the Bible, and there is another thought pattern in your mind, so the separation can start.
And this washing machine being under a hood -- we know that, in the Feast of Tabernacles, when the Jews under the old covenant celebrated it, they went out, and they built little sheds that they moved out of their houses and lived under these sheds. And that is Sukkot; it is the Feast of Tabernacles.
PASTOR VITALE: It is part of the Feast of Tabernacles. So this cleansing is closely associated with the Feast of Tabernacles. Well, we know that, you know? OK.
COMMENT: This woman -- she was on my left -- said that I could put a clothespin in the hole on top of the machine, and it would not break the machine.
PASTOR VITALE: OK. So first of all, she is a woman. Earlier, it was a man speaking to you.
PASTOR VITALE: What did the man say again?
COMMENT: He said -- I believe it was a man -- he said, after I passed this separate place, someone said to me that I had this beautiful fragrance emitting from my person.
PASTOR VITALE: OK. So the spiritual man Christ was saying, that was Christ saying to you that you have this beautiful fragrance. In other words, you are progressing in a measure that is pleasing to him. He is pleased at the measure with which you are progressing. Now we see a woman talking to you about not being afraid to put a clothespin into the washing machine. A woman is someone who would be a servant of God, someone in this soul realm who is still a human being but manifesting Christ. And she is telling you not to worry about using the washing machine in a particular way. Now clothespins -- of course, today, I know that some of them are made out of plastic. But years ago, they were made --
COMMENT: It was made of wood.
PASTOR VITALE: Oh, it was a wooden one. OK. It was a wood clothespin, and wood is made out of a tree, and trees typify man. So a clothespin is something that was cut out of a tree and fashioned into an item, and that is what God did. He cut Adam; he cut down the tree, and out of the tree, he formed a man. Right?
I know I just contradicted myself. The Scripture says Adam was formed out of the dust of the earth. But in another allegory, in another place in the Scripture, it is likened to God cutting down a tree, a spiritual tree. What was the tree that was cut down? It was the Son of God that was propelled into the earth at the beginning of time. And out of his substance, God formed the creation. To all of you Pharisees out there, I am not saying that God did not form Adam out of the dust of the ground. God sometimes expresses things in a different way to prove a different point.
So the clothespin, I would say, could typify you, or it could typify the whole church, or it could typify the firstfruits of the Sons of God, or it could typify the whole living soul. I am not really sure. But the servant of God was saying to you, Do not be afraid to put it in the washing machine. It is not going to break the washing machine. But I declare to you that the carnal mind of man really does not care about the washing machine. He is concerned about his own wellbeing, and he is afraid that he is not going to survive this cleansing.
And I have had people say it to me. I have had people speak it to me. I have had people tell me, You are killing me; you are destroying me; stop saying these things to me. I have had people tell me that. And my answer to them, or if you are out there reading this message and that is what you are thinking, I am telling you, you will surely not be destroyed because the Lord Jesus Christ is capable of cleansing you without breaking himself and without breaking you. And you shall come forth purified in the image of Christ.
COMMENT: So that is what I was afraid of. When that clothespin went in there, I could not hear the sound of the crunching, that was actually my own soul being --
PASTOR VITALE: Being ripped apart. Our soul is being ripped apart. I want to tell you this is true. Our soul is being ripped apart. It is being knocked; it is being banged; it is being hurt. But we will not die because this is the death of death. We are already dead. You cannot kill a dead person. All you could do is kill the death that they are, which means we are going to be resurrected unto life. It is death. It is death; we are dying, but what the carnal mind cannot see is the resurrection in Christ. Adam must die. He must die before -- you have to die before the resurrection comes. We have to die to this realm.
And God has shown me a couple of movies in this past year. The one that I remember, that comes to mind right now, is A Man Called Horse. And this was a British nobleman, came to the colonies, the United States, and he was captured by Indians. And he died to his whole life as a British nobleman. He died to his whole life as a British nobleman in the wilds of America, and he found himself living in a place that he never even dreamed of, in an Indian camp. And they put him into a female position. They made him a woman. His whole life changed. The only thing that did not change was his body, but his whole state of being changed. He was a man; they made him a woman. He was a nobleman; he was a slave. The language was different. The customs were different. He died to everything that he was, and he became an Indian.
And another movie that I saw was the Shaka Zulu, which I really recommend to anyone. If they ever play it on TV again, watch it. Did you see it?
COMMENT: What is it? [INAUDIBLE]
PASTOR VITALE: Shaka Zulu. It is the name of a Zulu chief. I think he lived in the 1600s, if I am not mistaken. And this, again, British naval officer was asked to take a team and go into the jungles of South Africa and try to make contact with this chief, who was infamous. He was notorious. He was famous in a negative way, as a killer, et cetera, et cetera.
And he went in with his team, and he died. He was not a captive. He had the ability to get out, but he was so impressed, despite their primitive ways, compared to the luxuries of Europe. Even in those days, they had, you know, things that the natives of South Africa or any part of Africa did not have. But he was so impressed by their code of life, by their lifestyle, by the way they lived, that he willingly died to everything British and became a Zulu.
And when he came back to Cape Town to see the -- I do not know what they called him, but he was the representative of the king in Cape Town. He came with Shaka’s ambassadors, respecting them as ambassadors, and he found that the king’s men would not recognize these natives and would not recognize that Shaka was a king and mistreated the people that he brought with him. And he was rebuked by his own naval officers. And they said to him, You cannot be both. What are you, British or Indian? And in a very moving part of the movie, he yells out, I am Zulu. He died to everything that he was, and he went back, and he spent the rest of his life. He even left his wife, went back and spent the rest of his life in the tribal world or the tribal village of the Zulu.
And that is what we must do. We cannot serve two masters. For a season, the Lord has permitted us to be a carnal man and Christ. But the Scripture clearly states, so long as we are in this condition, we shall be unstable in all of our ways. You cannot serve two masters. You cannot split yourself down the middle. We have got to get out of here. You cannot be both.
So that is what is happening to us now. And there is a whole church world of people out there that think that they are going to stay what they are. They are going to be soul men, but they are going to be granted all the gifts of the spiritual realm. No, you have got to die. We must die, but in accordance with Jesus’ program for our death. We have to die in the way he wants us to die, in accordance with his time table.
So that dream -- I do not really know your feelings well enough but to make a projection as to whether or not, in your deepest heart, you have fear of this judgment, or whether it was just a dream that God gives to his prophets about what is happening in the church world. I do not know. But, as far as I know, I have not seen the judgment touch you yet. If it has touched you, I am not aware of it. Is that on?
COMMENT: I have not either. But as I said, when I saw that this clothespin was in the machine, I got this feeling in my spirit that it was being crunched.
PASTOR VITALE: Well, it is.
COMMENT: No, I did not know. I could not understand it, but I saw it. And I thought to myself, something has got to happen with this clothespin. It is going to do something to that machine. But I did not realize that the machine was going to do something to the clothespin.
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah. But, you see, that is just the carnal mind. It always reverses it. Did you ever meet somebody that -- I have -- I am a very honest person, and I just do not like dishonesty. OK. A lot of people do not realize they are dishonest. Their mother and their father operated this way, and their grandparents operated this way, and they just handle life situations because that is the way everyone else handles it. They do not mean to be dishonest.
But there are people who will never come to you and say, What you are doing is distressing me. Please stop. They will come to you, and they will say, Well, I know you want to stop, and I know that it is time for you to leave, so I am not going to keep you any longer. I am going to let you go. And they put it on you. OK, that is typical of the carnal mind, and that is what the carnal mind is saying: Well, I am not going to admit that I am worried about being destroyed; I am going to say that I am worried about the washing machine. And that is typical of the carnal mind. It puts the burden on the other person, so that is just typically carnal.
But the Lord wants us to be honest, and he wants us to examine ourselves. And we cannot change overnight, but if our heart is right towards him, if you can receive what I am saying that this change must come, that everything in us that is ungodly must go and be replaced by the corresponding righteous characteristic of Christ. If you can believe this, and you submit yourself to God, he will put you on a program. He will, and he will do it for you. He will put you on a program of showing you what he wants you to deal with first. Nobody can change overnight. It takes a long time. It could take years. But if your heart is right before him, he will put you on a program.
He will say, This is what I want you to work on now. At first, he will show it to you, and you will probably say, I never had any idea that that was sin or that I was hurting anybody by it; you mean that was manipulation? All these years of doing that, I have been manipulating people? I never knew it. Well, all the Lord requires of you is to say, Yes, I hear you, Lord, and I say it; I confess it, and I repent. And now, if you help me, I am going to change. That is all he requires of you.
I am still going through this. I have been going through this for years, and I have had a tremendous amount of victory over some very ungodly qualities that are curses on my family line. My whole family did it. I did not know I was doing anything wrong. That is what everybody does. I did not know I was doing anything wrong. I just knew there was something wrong in my life, and there was something wrong with my relationships, but I did not know what. And when the Lord showed it to me, I started to resist the ungodliness, and he brought the change to pass and made it a permanent change in my personality. But I am still going through it. I am still working on things now. So I guess we will all be going through it until we are perfect, right?
So this is what the judgment is. This is what the White Throne Judgment is. It is the judgment of your soul by the Christ inside of you. And for the time period that the Christ inside of you is not strong enough to be doing the job, if your carnal man, your carnal mind, is still so strong that he blocks the messages that Christ in you is giving you that you cannot see it yourself, that you do not even hear when God is talking to you. Or if you hear when God is talking to you, you have trouble believing that it is really true because we are all in denial.
I mean, if it was not time for us to get cleansed by the Lord, for us to be looking upon all our faults would be very destructive to us. How could you go through life being an open book with no power to change? It would break your heart and kill you. So the natural man has a lot of defenses, and we do not see our own faults. When Jesus comes, he starts showing us our faults. So if our carnal mind is still so powerful that we cannot hear the word of the Lord, he will send somebody to tell us.
And that is a very hard thing to hear it from a human being. It is hard enough hearing from God. Most of the time, I hear it from God. It is very rare that he has to send another person to me because I hear. And I say, do not send another person to me. I do not want anybody to know. You know, that is not true. It is painful to hear it from another person. It is. But he has sent other people to me, and I have had to accept it. And almost every time it has happened, I have said, Yes, Lord, you told me, and I did not respond. And now you sent someone to me, and I repent. And I have had to do it a couple of times, not too often but a couple of times. But I have passed the test; I have done it.
So he will send someone to you because the Christ in you is not yet strong enough to take on your carnal mind. He will send another person. OK, it is usually me. I am the heavy. But I have not had this relationship with you yet. We have not entered into this relationship yet. But if the Lord tells me; if he arranges a situation, and I know that he is saying, Now is the time you tell her, I will have to tell you. And the question is: How are you going to respond? This is the White Throne Judgment. So for a season, he may send someone else to tell you because you cannot hear. But as soon as Christ in you is strong enough that you are doing this thing yourself, then no one else will have to tell you it.
You know, but even if, for the rest of the judgment, somebody has to tell you, so what? The way I look at it is that the only thing that matters is that I get cleaned up because I do not want to sin against anybody. The only thing I care about is that I get cleaned up. OK. My pride is not worth two cents, and that is all it is if you are hurt. It is pride. That is all it is. It is not worth two cents. I want to tell you, if I have anything to say about this thing at all, I am going through that door when it opens. As long as Jesus says that I am one of the ones, that could go through, so as long as I have my passport, there is not going to be anything that I am doing that is going to keep me out because I want to go through. So that is how I feel about it. You know? And that is the size of it.
So perhaps that dream means that the judgment of your soul might be starting soon. Now, I am convinced that the judgment of your soul does not start until Christ has been conceived in you because it is not the Holy Spirit that judges your soul. It is Christ. The Holy Spirit is the Father, and all judgment has been given unto the Son. So Christ has to be conceived in you before he starts judging your soul because, when he judges your soul, he is going to find it guilty. And when he finds it guilty, he is going to attack with the full intent of destroying that aspect of your soul of Adam.
So the Holy Spirit, that is not his job. And he is not strong enough to sustain you while your Adamic soul is being destroyed. All judgment had been given unto the Son, and Christ is enough to sustain you when Adam is killed. And God will not let your Adamic soul be killed with any more speed than Christ is growing up in you because, for every place that Adam is destroyed, Christ has to fill it in. You have to have a full, functioning soul. So if Adam is destroyed in a particular area, Christ has to start functioning for you in that area.
So I would say I think so. Yes, I think so because, if there is an ungodly part of your soul, and it is cast out, and it is not filled in with the righteous counterpart, you will just be lacking in your soul in that area. I think I would be very dangerous.
COMMENT: Yeah, I agree with that.
PASTOR VITALE: Very dangerous. So you have to have Christ conceived in you, and you cannot force it to go any faster than he is growing in you. He has got the perfect timing, you see?
So I would say that this dream -- that there is a really good chance -- I do not know for sure, but there is a really good chance that the Lord is telling you that you are about to start into the judgment. Because you are understanding the message so well, I think you have every reason to believe that he has been conceived in you. That is one of the signs that you are understanding this word. So the Lord may be telling you that judgment is on its way. And do not be afraid; you are not going to break. That is his word to you. It is a beautiful dream. Do not be afraid; you are not going to break. You are not going to break, that you are going to be raised from the dead.
COMMENT: I do not think that I really understood the interpretation of that dream until now, until you pointed that out.
PASTOR VITALE: But you may have it in your unconscious mind. Or maybe you do not. I really do not know.
COMMENT: Well, now I do. And I can see the -- I can see what you are saying.
PASTOR VITALE: Now you got it. Yeah.
COMMENT: You know, what I also felt was that you used to say that it is painful. And I questioned the Lord on it. I said, gee, and it does not seem to be painful.
PASTOR VITALE: It has not started.
COMMENT: But I guess it is because I have not --
PASTOR VITALE: It has not started yet. It is like you are nine months pregnant, walking around with this big belly, and you say, Gee, it does not hurt.
COMMENT: Sheila, I thought Ezekiel 28 -- and that is -- it is [UNINTELLIGIBLE] but that is us. Is it not Adam and us?
PASTOR VITALE: Ezekiel 28?
COMMENT: Ezekiel 28. Tyrus, rather.
PASTOR VITALE: We did that. Did we not do that in one of the basic principles messages?
COMMENT: I got in again this morning.
PASTOR VITALE: The word of the Lord came again unto to me, saying, ‘Son of man,’ -- saying to the prince of Tyrus -- because thine heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, 'I am a God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas.' Well, this is Adam. Yes.
PASTOR VITALE: Yet thou art a man and not God. You got this this morning?
PASTOR VITALE: Well, it could be another witness to my dream.
COMMENT: OK. Yeah. So I thought maybe we could talk about it if we had time here.
PASTOR VITALE: Well, this is God’s indictment of Adam. He says, Adam, you are saying you are a God, and you are sitting in the seat of God, because, you know, this man that we talked about earlier -- it is not on the message, but this man that is a preacher; he answers to nobody. And I think I mentioned this on a recent message. Every human being alive answers to somebody. Every minister answers to somebody. If you think that a minister that is not in a denomination but a minister that is independent -- if you are that minister, and you think you answer to nobody, you are mistaken. And if you are not a minister, and you think that ministers that are independent answer to nobody, you are very mistaken. We answer to the Lord. If the Lord has indeed called us and put us in the ministry, we are spiritual men. And the only one over the spiritual man is Christ.
But you better believe that we have to answer for everything we do. Every encounter that I have with a member of this congregation, I have to answer to God for how I handled it. Everything I teach you, everything I say -- and if I make a mistake, I am required to go to you and correct it, or I will hear from my boss.
But what happens is that some people are carnal. Some men are carnal, and it is a great danger to be in an independent ministry and think that there is no one for you to answer to. And this particular preacher that we were talking about earlier, he used to say from the pulpit all the time (he said it frequently): This is not a democracy. It is a dictatorship. I am in charge here. And it really upset me that he said that, and I prayed about it. And the Lord gave me an opportunity.
And I want to tell you something, God may give you a word for somebody. Please wait for God’s timing. I can have a word in my heart for months before God arranges a situation where he wants that person told. Well, God arranged a situation, and I told him what God told me. I said, You know, God told me that this is not a dictatorship. It is a theocracy. God is in charge. It is better than any democracy that ever existed, and that every person, from the least unto the greatest, from a small child to a retarded person, anybody has the right to petition the Lord about what you are doing. And if they are wrong, the Lord will deal with them, and it will not go any further. But if they are right, the Lord will deal with you. You are not a dictator. And I want to tell you, I never heard him say that from the pulpit again, so I would say that God honored my prayer.
No human being is without authority over him. The problem with the condition of the church today is that the church is so caught up that the large majority of people do not recognize the authority over them. Why? Because he is a Spirit. He is a Spirit, and when they do not obey him, it takes him a long time to execute judgment. And even if it takes him a week to execute judgment, they are so carnal, they do not even know that they are being chastened for not listening to him. It is the truth. They think it is the devil. So the church is in a mess.
I ministered to a rabbi. He told me yesterday; he said, What kind of a Christianity is this? There is no head to your organization. Everybody does what they want. One preaches one thing; another preaches something else. There is no connection between anybody. And I had to say to him, You are right. He said, How could you say to me they preach it one way and you preach it another way? What kind of a religion is that? And I had to tell him, You are right that it does not look good, but you are wrong that there is no head. There is a head. It is just that the large part of the church cannot see him. They think that Satan is their head, and that God is Satan. They have got it backwards.
But very soon, the government of God, which is Christ, who in this hour is in Spirit form, is going to appear. He is going to appear. The Spirit, the spiritual head of the church, is going to appear in full stature in a group of men. And then there will no longer be any question about who is the head of the church. Why? Because the Lord is very longsuffering because he knows we are carnal. When the firstfruits manifest and it can be seen, for all to see, that these are the men upon whom God has put his Spirit, those who are in rebellion are going to be killed like [UNINTELLIGIBLE]. They are going to be killed or severely chastened, and the church is going to come into submission to Christ. Right now, it is a mess. It is an absolute mess.
So we have this man over there that is the pastor; he calls himself a pastor of this independent church, and he thinks he does not answer to anybody. He does not think there is a God in heaven. Well, he would not admit that to you, but he certainly has no fear of that God in heaven. To be honest with you, I do not know what is in his mind. Maybe he just thinks that God has given him absolute dictatorial powers. Maybe he is just deceived in his mind that he thinks, because God put him over this church, that he could do anything we wants. Maybe that is what he thinks. I do not know what he thinks. All I know is you have to be out of your mind to do what he is doing. And I want to tell you that, if you are abiding in Adam, you are out of your mind.
I would be scared out of my mind of what the Lord would do. I could not even consider doing the things that he has done. I am so afraid of God, and it is a healthy fear. It is a healthy fear of God. Do not misunderstand what I am saying. Fear of God is the beginning of wisdom. That means, if you have no fear of God, you have no wisdom. If you have no wisdom, you are a fool. That is what the Bible says. Either you are wise, or you are a fool. God help us.
So we are told, in Ezekiel 28, that God is telling Adam, You think you are God, and you are sitting in the seat of God. What does that mean? You are in the mind of man, saying that you are God. This is all over the church world today. They are saying that it is God, and it is not God. It is not God. It is not God telling them to hate the Sons. It is not God telling them to reject the true message. It is not God.
You know, I went before the Lord recently, and I questioned him about this issue of him hardening men’s hearts. And I said, Lord, I know that you are righteous and that your ways are perfect, so I must be not understanding something. Why would you harden somebody’s heart, so that they could get into trouble with you?
And he said, I have not caused anybody to sin or to get into trouble with me. But because I am calling all men, each man in his own order, because it is not everybody’s time right now, I will harden their heart because I cannot have chaos. I have to have order in my church, and it is each man in his own order. So when I do not let them see what I am doing, it just reveals what they truly are. I have not made them sin. I have not told them to do the evil that they do. What I have done is blinded them from the light of God, and what you are seeing is their true nature. That is what he said to me. What you are seeing is their true nature. I have not made them that way. I have not told them to do that. I have just lifted my hand off of them, so that they are themselves. When I put my hand on them, they are not themselves. Hallelujah.
Well, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas. The sea is the unconscious mind of the living soul. But God says, Nevertheless, you are a man and not God, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God. And we had a teaching on the heart in a recent message. And he said, You are saying that your heart is the heart of God, but you are a liar. And the men who have the Holy Spirit, their heart is not the heart of God. They think, because they have the Holy Spirit, they have the heart of God. But the Holy Spirit is not the heart of God, and the man that has the Holy Spirit has in fact the heart of man, which is what? Do you remember? The carnal mind, the carnal mind. Heart and mind are the same thing.
And as we said earlier, when the fruit comes forth, it destroys the flower. When the fruit, which is the heart of God, comes forth, you do not have the Holy Spirit anymore. You do not have the Holy Spirit anymore. You have the heart of God.
Now there could be an overlapping period where you have both. I do not speak in tongues very much anymore, but I do sometimes. And the rule largely is that I will speak in tongues when, by the wisdom that has already been imparted to me, the mind of Christ that has already been imparted to me, I do not have enough knowledge or wisdom to know how to deal with a particular situation. Then I will speak in tongues or prophesy because prophecy and tongues and all the gifts come forth not out of knowledge. It comes out beyond your natural ability to know what to do. And I have a lot of wisdom with God. I know how to deal with a lot of situations, and then I do not prophecy or speak in tongues. I deal with it out of the heart of Christ that is in me; this is wisdom and knowledge of how to deal with things that has come forth from the mind of God plus experience.
But when I was in Nigeria, I came under a severe attack. One night, I could not preach, and I did not know what to do because the heart of God that was in me at the time was not telling me what to do. I did not know what to do. I could not preach. Something was stopping me spiritually, and I could not overcome it. So what happened? The Lord rose up in me and prophesied. He went beyond my natural ability.
Now as Christ comes forth in me, do not misunderstand what I am saying by using the word natural. When Christ begins to be formed in you, you are him, and that is what I mean by my natural ability. When a supernatural manifestation comes forth, such as tongues or prophecy or a word of knowledge, OK, that is something that is beyond what you are in your own person. Eventually, when the mind of Christ fills us completely, we will not need the gifts anymore because everything that we need will be a part of the being that we are. Does anybody not understand what I am saying? OK. So if you find that you are talking in tongues less or you are using the gifts less, do not panic because you may be in -- well, ask the Lord. You may be in transition.
It is a blessing for me to be able to tell you this because, all of the wisdom that I have, that I share with you, there was nobody to teach me. I learned the hard way, and you are benefiting from my experience. I was in great distress. I hardly spoke in tongues anymore. The prophecy died down. The deliverance, the old order deliverance, died down. I used to pray very long, anointed prayers. I could not do that anymore, and I was really upset, and nobody knew what was wrong with me. I went for deliverance; it did not help.
And then, after crying out to God for quite a while, someone came to me in church and said, I do not know why, but I really feel the Lord wants me to give you this magazine. And I looked at it, and it was not a magazine that I would normally be interested in reading. But of course, I said thank you. And I said, Well, it may be the Lord, and I better not risk not reading it if there is a message for me in here. So I sat down, and I started leafing through the magazine. And there was an article in it describing exactly what was happening to me. And the article explained it, that, as you mature in Christ, this is what happens. And that was how I found out what was happening to me.
But I was really upset. I was really upset. And those of you that know me from years ago -- I used to dance in the Spirit. I used to jump all over the church. I was like a nut, you know, the way I danced in the Spirit. I was very emotional in the Spirit. And after that, the witnesses started flooding in. And I had gotten a newsletter from another ministry where the writer said, Well, you know, I go to these churches, and I do not jump up and down, and they are very distressed with me. They think that I am not behaving properly because I do not do what they do, but I just do not jump up and down anymore. And I said, Yeah, I just do not jump up and down anymore. I have grown up in God.
Every once in a while, I will dance in the Spirit, but it is rare. I used to do it at every meeting. I used to dance; I used to leap; I used to scream. I used to get slain in the Spirit and lay on the floor in exhaustion. I do not do that anymore. I have not been slain in the Spirit after dancing in a long time. And I only dance once in a while. The Spirit has to move me to do it.
And as the Lord explained to me, everything that was upon me, all that anointing that was upon me, all that emotion, all that excitement, it became internalized when I conceived Christ. The whole purpose of that outpouring on me was that I should conceive Christ. And when I conceived Christ, the beginning of my maturity started. And my immaturity started to decrease. The one must decrease so that Christ could increase.
Just as we see children in the natural growing up, six months, one year. They walk; they talk; they toilet train. They are babies, and they look different. But it is the younger they are, the more they look alike. If you look at the baby, you could see the face is different. But the younger they are, the more they look alike, do they not? They all look alike, babies. You go to a hospital and look at all the babies in the nursery, they all look very similar, the younger they are.
And I am suggesting to you that, in the Spirit, we are going through the same stages. I talk to people today; they are going through the same thing. They are all going through the same thing, not exactly, exactly the same, but they are all going through the same stages: the excitement, the withdrawal of the gifts, the concern. There is a stage of rebellion. There is a stage where you rebel against the minister. Everybody goes through it, some a little more, some a little less. You talk about the pastor; you do not like this one. It is a stage, just like growing up, like the terrible twos, you know. And you have to see it with spiritual eyes because the people are usually adults of all different natural backgrounds, different sexes, different jobs, different families. But if God gives you spiritual eyes to see it, you will see that we are all going through the same thing. And there are stages that we go through and God has shown it to me, how people are really spiritual children and things that spiritual children do and the dangers of spiritual children.
But where a lot of ministers get messed up is they get a revelation of this, but they try to protect the people in the natural. Like I said to you earlier, I have no right to tell you not to go. But I do have a right to give you my opinion. My opinion is I do not think you should go, but if you go, there is nothing I could do about it. The only thing what I can do about it is say, Lord, if this is your wisdom in me, and they should not go, and you do not want them to go, you are going to have to stop them from going because I am not about to get into any witchcraft. That is the fullest extent that I could go. But a lot of ministers out there, they will see the sheep in danger, and they do not trust the Lord. That is what it comes down to. And they try to do it in the flesh, and then it becomes witchcraft, so you cannot do that. You cannot do that.
So I do not know how I got on this subject. I do not know where I started out. Oh, I know what I was saying: that the Adamic man is calling his heart the heart of God, and it is not. And I have heard a lot of preachers preach, you have the mind of Christ. No, you do not. You have access to the mind of Christ to the fullest extent that the Lord is willing to give it to you in any particular situation. But you have a carnal mind that operates in you all the time. And if you want to access the mind of God or the heart of God, exactly that, you have to access it.
If you can liken yourself to lying in a hospital bed; God forbid it should ever happen to you, but this is the only example that is coming to me because, spiritually, we are all in hospital beds. We are all very sick, spiritually. If you can see yourself laying in a hospital bed, and there is an oxygen mask within your reach, and the doctor or the nurse says to you, If you need oxygen, just reach up and get the oxygen mask, well, somebody could say you have an oxygen mask; somebody could say you have oxygen, but it is just there. You are not using it. You are breathing the natural air until you access the oxygen mask. You have to reach up, grab it, lock it on your face and turn the cylinder on.
That is our relationship to the mind of Christ. We function in the carnal mind 24 hours a day. It is likened to the natural air that we are breathing. But to the fullest extent that God will permit us in any given situation, we can reach for the mind of Christ, and the way we reach for it is by saying, Lord, what would you think in this situation? How would you feel? What would you think? What would you do? Lord, I do not want to be a carnal person. Give me your reactions to this problem.
And for whatever God’s reason, this is the way he does it. He does not come in with his mind unless you specifically ask for it. I have found that there are a lot of things, a lot of answers, that he will give me only when I ask for it. Sometimes he tells me things without me asking, like tonight; he told me to come to church. I had forgotten that it was a meeting. That never happens. That has never happened to me before, never.
But when it comes to wisdom, knowledge, understanding, when it comes to dealing with a problem, if I do not say, Lord, give me your mind, the chance, well, I will say that is the way it used to be; I would respond with my carnal mind. But at this point, I respond very frequently with the mind of Christ because the Lord knows that my overall desire is to manifest him. And there is a lot of him in me already. So a large part of the time, I automatically respond in Christ, but it was not always that way. I would respond as a natural man, and of course, it is not in all areas because I still pray that way a lot when I feel in my heart.
You see, the key word is that we really have to be honest with ourselves about our own thoughts and our own emotions because, if I feel myself responding to somebody, and I know that it is Adamic, I will know that it is Adamic, and I resist it. This is the battle of Armageddon. I say, I do not want these thoughts. I do not want these emotions. I do not want these feelings. I want to react exactly as Christ would react in this situation. That is how I pray. I very rarely pray traditionally, very rarely. God has to really tell me to do it. These are my prayers. This is how I pray. And I will say, Lord, I do not like what I am feeling in my heart, and I do not like what I am thinking in my mind; put your thoughts in there. And he gives me the victory.
So that is how we stop from sinning. Little by little, this is how we stop from sinning. But of course, we have to be able to recognize the sin in our mind. We have to recognize the ungodly thought and ungodly desire. Or if we cannot catch it right away, even once the word is out of our mouth, we have to be able to realize that we subtly attacked that person. And when we realize that, we have to say, Lord, why did I do it? What was my motive? Was it envy? You know, why did I subtly attack that person? This is a spiritual labor that we are all called to enter into.
QUESTIONS & COMMENTS
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah, just take the microphone. Thank you.
COMMENT: How long did it take for you to come into that after you started with deliverance, that you were able to hear him?
PASTOR VITALE: I think it was pretty fast with me, because I was pretty desperate when I came to the Lord. I really do not remember exactly how.
COMMENT: Do you think it has anything to do with the calling that was on your life in the beginning?
PASTOR VITALE: Probably, because it was very easy for me, and I am finding out that it is not that easy for other people. I thought that it would be as easy for everybody as it was for me, but God is showing me that it is not.
COMMENT: Because you hear him a lot easier than most. Some people hear him, but it is not that they can have a running-on conversation with him.
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah. I do not really remember when that started, but I know that, when I was in deliverance, every night I went up on that prayer line, he told me what I was getting delivered from. And I once, you know, talked to that pastor about it because, every time I got up there, I got deliverance. You know, a lot of people went up there, and they did not get deliverance. And he asked me once, How do you know? How do you decide what is? And I said, Oh, the Lord tells me, and he just looked at me like he could not believe what I was telling him. I said, Everything I asked for, God told me tonight, 'You are getting delivered from that.' And that was how it worked with me.
So he showed me my sins, and I saw them. And I had the ability to confess them and repent. And as I said, he has been showing me that everybody cannot do that. So we have to work with patience and compassion with people that have trouble confessing their sins. As long as God witnesses to my heart that he has not turned away from them because of their refusal to repent, we have to work with them.
COMMENT: I think, in a lot of cases, I do not think it is that people are really refusing to repent, because sometimes you do not even know it is evil that is in your heart.
PASTOR VITALE: Exactly. That is why, if you cannot see it yourself, you have to be told sometimes, you know? But he is not going to give it to you all at once because he does not want to overwhelm you. He wants you to change, so he gives it to you a little bit at a time. Sometimes it will come forth in the preaching, but some people are not even convicted from the preaching. So, he will get the information to you in whatever way he has to because he wants you cleaned up. He wants you cleaned up.
And the warfare is resisting our old carnal ways and refusing to do these things anymore. That is the warfare. And let me tell you, it is a warfare because, when Satan gets the idea that you are really serious about this, he does have authority to give you some hard times. He cannot destroy you, but he can harass you. He definitely can harass you and give you some hard times.
And as I said earlier this evening, this has not happened to me in a long time, but there was some spirit of confusion on me today. And actually, it started a couple of days ago, but it has been increasing. And he plays with my emotions. But what God has shown me to do is to ignore my emotions. In other words, if I will have a day where I am really distressed in my emotions, much to my disappointment, the Lord does not make this distress go away. In our childishness, and I have been through this, we would say, Lord, I am distressed in my emotions. I thought you were my savior. Make it go away. But he does not make it go away. Why? Because he is killing our Adamic soul.
And his answer to this, and his answer to this for me, and I believe it is for everybody, with maybe some minor variations, is: Live out of Christ. Live out of Christ. So when I am distressed in my soul -- well, you do not have to be joyous. It is nice if you can be, but we cannot force ourselves to be joyous. But what we can force ourselves to do is what we know God wants us to do, whatever that is. In my case, it means, get back into your study. Prepare your message. Do the work of the ministry. No matter what kind of a sadness is in my soul, I do it anyway. And as you know, I am sick a lot more than I would like to be. And to the fullest extent that I can, I work sick. The only time I go to bed is when I really cannot get up. I will take the day in bed when I really cannot get out of bed, which happens every once in a while. But I work sick with all kinds of physical problems. And this is what the Lord has shown me: You just keep on going to the fullest extent that you can. By Christ, you just keep on going.
And one night, I will never forget this night. It was a very good meeting, and it was a long meeting, and there were a lot of questions afterwards. And the Lord was bringing forth real teaching through the questions. And I was not feeling well that night. And almost from the minute I started preaching, I was telling everybody I am going to be ending this meeting early. And it was one of the longest meetings I had ever had.
And one of the people afterwards, one of the young fellows, he said to me, I could not believe you. You were obviously physically overwhelmed, and you just kept on going. He said, I never saw anything like it in my life. And that was the night that the Lord brought forth knowledge of -- he preached out of his Spirit because I answered questions. Well, this happens to me a lot, but it was just starting at that time that someone will ask me a question and I do not know the answer, and as I start to talk, the answer comes forth right out of the realm of his Spirit. And then I learn it as well as you.
And it happened a lot that night. We had some really glorious truths coming down. And the next day, this young man said to me, I could not believe you. I could not believe what you looked like, and you just kept on talking. Well, this is what God has done with me, and I think it is what he wants to do with all of us. He wants to get us to the point where nothing that Satan can do can stop us from obeying God. You have to keep on going.
And I think I told you, at the beginning of the meeting, that this happens to me in the meetings a lot. I sit down to preach, and I get so attacked in my emotions. You would not believe the thoughts that go through my mind. And I preach in agony. This happens to me a lot. The whole hour and a half or two hours that I am preaching, I am in emotional torment.
And I used to think a lot that the message was ruined. Now I know that the message is not ruined. While I am going through it, I know the message is not ruined because it has happened so many times already, but my carnal mind is telling me the message is ruined. But I know it is not, so I just keep on preaching. And I listen to the message, and I say, yeah, that is a good message. But the whole time that I am preaching, I am in torment. I am being tortured with the thoughts that are going through my mind and my emotions.
But Satan's ability to stop me is very small in comparison to the whole of my activity. Now what happened to me today has not happened to me in one long time, but the Lord let it happen because I had to meet that person in the supermarket. Glory to God.
So he works everything together. It is very exciting. It is a good feeling to really believe that he is in control of everything. I found out there is a difference between knowing and believing. I used to believe that God was in control of everything. Now I am starting to really know it. And it is a peace. It is really a peace.
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah. It is really a peace. It is wonderful to know that, no matter what happens, God is with you, and you cannot be destroyed. And not to believe it, but to know it; not to believe it with your intellect, but to know it with your heart, that all things are working for your good. And every once in a while, my own heart still tries to condemn me, and I just tell it right off. I say, I will not receive this condemnation. You cannot condemn me. I made a mistake; I repented, and I am going on. You cannot condemn me. I argue with my soul all the time, argue with my carnal mind, rebuke it.
Paul said, I keep my body under, and I do not think he was talking about his physical body. I gave this to you once before. I do not know if you remember it, but the Adamic soul is the body of the soul of Christ. It is the body of Christ. This body, this physical body, is the body of Satan. So when Paul said, I keep my body under, the body of the spiritual man is the Adamic man. That is a great mystery. I am telling you, there is mysteries in the Scripture. There are things that are not for everybody to understand.
COMMENT: I got excited today, in LEM message #38 (14 parts), AROUND THE THRONE, I am not sure if it was part 9 or 10. And when you were talking about what is going to be an explosion. And when that happened, boy, I was praising God. I said, Lord, this is exciting. It is going to be better than any explosion, and the Father is going to split the atom again. I said, Wow.
PASTOR VITALE: He is going to fuse it back together.
COMMENT: He is going to be causing such an explosion that everyone is going to know something.
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah, yeah. Fusion. He is going to fuse it back together. And the heat that comes forth from the fusing it together is much greater than the heat that comes forth from splitting the atom, which is atomic fission. Yeah, and that is what Peter was talking about when he said the elements are going to melt. Well, it has already started.
Transcribed by VerbalFusion 08/28/18
08/31/18 1st Edit, rh