The Following Message Has Been Transcribed By The LEM Transcribing & Editing Team.
...one more thing I would like to explain to you, let me remind you it is very important that you understand, we are entering into the imparted anointing, we are going beyond the gifts whereby the Spirit of God will flow through you with a prophecy which you may understand or you may not understand that you have nothing to say about, that you have nothing to do with, you are just a vessel that the Spirit of God flows through. We are going beyond that, we are called the imparted anointing, where the Lord wants us to be a joint heir with Him, a co-partner, a co-son, He wants us to understand what He is doing and why He is doing it, and He wants us to start making decisions based on everything we have learned, based on His Spirit and His life, and everything He has learned and taught us. Does anyone not understand the difference?
What I would like to point out to you is that the judgments that were executed tonight came forth from a motive, and that motive that he hurt my feelings, that motive was not that he depressed me or damaged me in any way, that motive was not even to defend Xxxx because God is her defense, and I do not take on ungodly burdens. The motive that brought forth the execution of judgment tonight, was the righteousness of God, and I ask that the Lord witness this to you because that is the only legitimate motive for executing judgment, that the Christ in me reached a point of outrage at the general overall wickedness and evil that has been flowing out of this man and his cohorts for all of these years. Does anybody not understand what I am saying?
An outrage rose up out of the Christ in me, and said, Enough is enough. We have prayed for him, we have prayed for his repentance, we have blessed him, we have asked for mercy upon him, and the man continues to kill. Brethren, in this society if someone continues to kill, in some states we have the death penalty, hopefully in more of them, but at the very least they are put behind bars for life. He must be restrained. As sons of God, we are to judge angels, what is an angel, is it a spirit, there are evil angels and there are good angels, the Scripture just says we are going to judge angels. Did it say which angels we were going to judge?
Angels, spiritual men, we shall judge spiritual men, if the spiritual man is spiritual because Christ is living through him, there is no law against him, no judgment. Therefore I suggest to you Paul was talking about the evil angels. We shall be judging the evil angels, unregenerate fallen men who have become spiritual outside of Christ. Does anyone not understand what I just said? If you are spiritual in Christ against the Spirit of God there is no law. We shall judge the evil angels, that are doing what in accordance to Revelation 12? That are trying to keep the Christ from arising in the many members of humanity.
Only God knows whether these judgments will result in the release of Christ in him from the bondage of a wicked carnal mind, and let him stand up and be victorious, or whether God could kill him, I am not going to lie to you, I do not know, I do not make that judgment, or least not where I am now I do not make that judgment, I do not see anything in the Scripture that would indicate that Jesus of Nazareth ever made that kind of a judgment.
I cannot see it, if it is in there, I cannot see it. What we do is identify and mark the sin, the Father decides what He is going with the people. We judge, all judgment is given unto the son, we judge tonight that, that is not Christ in that man but it is a wicked manifestation of the carnal mind, that is doing great damage to God's people and God's kingdom. The motive was the righteous indignation of Christ, no personal gain. Does anyone not believe that? Is anyone having trouble seeing it, or understanding it? It is important, because this is part of the major thrust of this ministry right now is to help you distinguish between Christ and the carnal mind.
If my motive was anything other than what I just said, it would not have been Christ in me, it would have been my carnal mind, and you have to be able to tell the difference, in me and in everybody else. If you cannot tell, if you are not convinced that it was the righteous indignation of Christ, tell the Lord and I ask that He witness it to you, and that He teach you and show you how to recognize it and how to tell the difference, because as this warfare increases we are going to have to be making split second judgments as to what spirit is manifesting in possibly a total stranger, it has to come to the point where it is automatic.
You have to start somewhere, it may not be automatic, but at least be able to recognize it twenty four later after you have prayed about it, it is a start, it is a start. Things are speeding up, Xxxx was telling me on the way over here that a building collapsed in Hauppauge today, just collapsed, just like the plane, it just fell out of the air, a jet with a perfect record of safety just fell out of the sky, and now an office building in Hauppauge just collapsed, brethren, things are going very fast.
Do not let what I am saying scare you, just tell the Lord that you mean business, and you are willing to do anything that He asked you to do so long as He gives you the power to do it, you cannot do it if He does not give you the power, but turn your face towards Him, and say Lord, Here I am, I want the skills and the weapons that I am going to need to take an active part in this glorious outpouring of His Spirit that is already descending. Hallelujah.
I will tell you one more thing and then I am going to preach, I watched the 700 Club today, and they had a woman on the 700 Club who claims that she was fire from Eastern Airline, and eleven year old employee, she was there eleven years with a perfect record of employment, and it was the year that president Reagan declared that year the year of the Bible, and she was a Christian and she took her Bible and put it on her desk, and her boss came out and said, What is that Bible doing on your desk? She said, Well it is the year of the Bible, and it comforts me, it is closed you know, it is just sitting there. Her boss said, You know you are sick, you should get rid of that.
One thing led to another, he called her in demanded that she take it off of her desk, and she refused to do it, and he fired her, after eleven years of exemplary service. Then when she went to try and collect unemployment, she could not collect unemployment because the paper that he filled out said that she quit, and said nothing whatsoever about what really transpired, and apparently she did not know how to go about it, or was not able to go about opposing this. She said she lost everything, she went into bankruptcy, she lost her home, she lost car, she went into utter ruin. Then Eastern Airlines went bankrupt. Pat Robertson said on 700 Club, but there is a good possibility that there was some divine judgment at work here. Brethren, you cannot do this, you cannot do this! God is not blind, do not be deceived because He is winking for a season, and if His judgment does not speedily fall, He has His purposes, you will answer for everything that you have done, unless you repent and go and make it right, you will surely receive the recompense of God whether you are a Christian, or whether you are not a Christian. Brethren, if you sin against your brother, get on your shoes and run to him to make it right. If you owe him money, give him his money, do not fight over money!
Time is very short brethren. We are going to be seeing some mighty from the heavenlies. I have one more thing to tell you before we start. I mentioned to you all that this past Wednesday, yesterday was the Feast of Tabernacles and I was hoping that the catching up would be this week, and the Lord has shown me that yesterday was not the day, yesterday I was not feeling well, I was laying in bed and I said, Well I guess it did not happen to me anyway, maybe it happened to someone else, but the Lord showed me that yesterday was not the day.
I just want to show it to you, it is in the Scripture, it is in Leviticus 23, and I want you to know that I am very encouraged because why would God show me that it was the wrong day if He is not going to do anything on the right day anyway, and it was a distinct word of knowledge, it started last night. First Xxxx called me, I guess it was Tuesday, and she said the Lord gave her Chronicles 29, which said something about that it might not be that day, it might the 16th day, and I said, Oh I cannot be bothered with this. It was not yesterday, I cannot be getting all caught up in this, and I let it go, and all I remember is like for the last two hours before I went to sleep last night, I kept hearing, I knew it was the Lord, I knew it was a word of knowledge, I kept hearing Sukkot. Anybody know what Sukkot is?
COMMENT: That time with the booths?
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah, with the booths. I was not a religious Jew but I was raised, Rosh Hashanah which was last week, Yom Kippur which was yesterday and Sukkot is not important, never in my life did I celebrate Sukkot, I was not even sure what it was, I went to my calendar on the wall, and Yom Kippur and Rosh Hashanah was on the calendar, and Sukkot was not, I though it might be in the springtime I was not even sure when it was. I was in a bad mood yesterday, and I said forget this whole thing and I went to sleep.
I woke up this morning, and as I told Xxxx and Xxxx Tuesday, I never read except when God tells me to read something, and I woke up this morning and get all of these newsletters that I usually give to Xxxx, and I only read them when God tells me to read something. There is this Jews for Jesus newsletter laying there, and I pick it up, and I start reading it, and there it is, Sukkot is the Feast of Tabernacles, not Yom Kippur. I followed it through and at this point, I could not resist the Lord anymore, and I found it in Leviticus 23 and I will put in simple English before I show it to you, the Feast of Tabernacles is in three parts, the first part is the blowing of the trumpets which we all know to be this kingdom message, the second part is the day of atonement which was yesterday and I am going to show you Leviticus 23 that if you do not afflict your soul, there is no way you are going to enter in.
For the Jews afflicting your soul was not eating, but I am going to suggest to you that the spiritual affliction of your soul is the wounding of the carnal mind that we have been talking about here, it is the judgment of your carnal mind so that Christ can be exalted. This whole kingdom church out there that does not believe in the judgment, they will not go on to full stature, and they are preaching a lie and they are going to fall by the thousands, people that believe it are going to fall by the thousands, you cannot enter into the fullness without afflicting your soul.
COMMENT: That is atonement, afflicting your soul and the judgment?
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah, that is the day of atonement. They are preaching out there in this camp, they preaching out there be nice to your soul, it is a lie, it is the exact opposite in Scripture, and the third part of the feast of Tabernacles is Sukkot, when you build booths and come out of your house and go into another house. I do not know what is going to happen, but I am excited all over again, I think something is going to happen, I hope it is full stature, but if it is not, there has to be reason that God made this correction this year. I just want to show it to you in Leviticus so that you can be armed with the Scripture. It starts in verse 24,
24. Speak unto the children of Israel saying, in the seventh month, (this is the seventh month of the Hebrew calendar which is now), in the first day of the month, shall ye have a Sabbath, a memorial, a blowing of trumpets, a holy convocation.
25. Ye shall do no servile work therein, but ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the Lord. KJV
Let me point out to you that this no servile work, what that means to us is the laying down of the works of the carnal mind, we have been preaching that here, we have been preaching that here a lot. You have to lay down your servile work, only the spiritual work of God is acceptable. Do you understand what I just said?
26. And the Lord spake unto Moses saying,
27. Also on the tenth day of this seventh month, there shall be a day of atonement (that is what happened yesterday), it shall be a holy convocation unto you, and ye shall afflict your souls, (you shall wound your carnal mind and refuse to obey it), and offer an offering made by fire unto the Lord. KJV
That offering is your own soul brethren, the Christ in you must wound and thereby offer up your soul, also known as your carnal mind to the Father.
28. And ye shall do no work in that same day, for it is a day of atonement, to make an atonement for you before the Lord your God.
29. For whatsoever soul it be that shall not be afflicted in that same day, he shall be cut off from among the people. KJV
God have mercy on the Christians that have bought this lie that there is no judgment and that you should be nice to your soul.
30. And whatsoever soul it be that doeth any work in that same day, the same soul will I destroy from among his people. KJV
Brethren, the person that continues to live out of their carnal mind, even if they have Christ, the Lord says He is going to destroy their soul, and I am going to suggest to you that the soul He is going to destroy is the soul of Christ. If you do not use it brethren, you are going to lose it. God is not playing games, He has got mercy on you as you begin to learn, and as you begin to hear this message, but it is His full intention to bring you to a place where you fully resist any and every thought that comes from your carnal mind no matter how harmless it appears to be, and only obey His mind, and if you are playing games with God, you are running the risk of losing your Christ soul, and then what? You will be a natural man, and you will live out the rest of your life and you will pass on, and you will lose your opportunity to partake of His glory that is about to be poured out here. Verse 31;
31. Ye shall do no manner of work, (your own works), it shall be a statute forever throughout your generations in all your dwellings.
32. It shall be unto a Sabbath of rest, and ye shall afflict your souls... KJV
Listen to how the Lord repeats and repeats it and repeats it, so sometimes you afflict your soul, sometimes I afflict your souls, let us get our souls afflicted around here. As hard as it is for people to understand, if someone afflicts your soul in Christ, it is truly the love of God, because if your soul does not get afflicted, you are going to be cut off from Israel.
32b. ...in the ninth day of the month at even, from even unto even shall ye celebrate your Sabbath.
33. And the Lord spoke unto Moses saying;
34. Speak unto the children of Israel saying, The fifteenth day of this seventh month, (that is next Sunday night at midnight and Monday, going in to Monday), shall be the feast of tabernacles for seven days unto the Lord.
35. On the first day, (that is next Monday), shall be a holy convocation, you shall do no servile work.
36. Seven days ye shall offer an offering made by fire, (that is your carnal mind being burned by the Christ) unto the Lord... KJV
Every time you choose to reject your carnal mind and obey Christ, your carnal mind is being roasted in the fire of Christ. Amen!
36b. ...on the eighth day shall be a holy convocation unto you; KJV
So the two most important days are the first day and the eighth day. That is Monday, It is either the following Sunday or Monday.
36c. ...and ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the Lord, etc, etc. KJV
We have a whole week the Feast of Tabernacles will run a whole week starting next Monday, and I have told the Lord I would like to be caught up to full stature, but I will take anything He wants to give me, but I believe there is going to be some kind of an increase, some kind of weakness that we are going to receive the power to overcome, some measure of catching up. I believe that it is going to affect the whole church, the elements of the church that have not yet heard the trumpet blow, are going to start to hear the trumpet blow. The elements of the church that have heard the trumpet blow, but have not afflicted their soul, according to God they may be brought into judgment against their own will. I do not know, but they are going to start to experience the affliction of their soul. Those of us that have been hearing the trumpet and afflicting our soul, well the only thing left for us brethren, is to be caught up, yeah, or some measure thereof. It is the only left for us, to have our soul roasted with fire. Hallelujah.
COMMENT: What did they do sacrifices?
PASTOR VITALE: No, they move out of their homes and they live in that, it is a change of house. We are not getting a new body in this hour, but what we are getting is a new soul, the implication for us is that Eve our human spirit is exiting our carnal mind and moving into Christ, a new house for our spirit.
COMMENT: What was the purpose of them doing that, I am trying to figure that out?
PASTOR VITALE: Showing gratitude to the Lord that He kept them in their wilderness experience when they really could have died except for His supernatural provision, you know just showing that they appreciate the Lord. I think the natural Jew, what they are saying to me does not make any sense you know, but the spiritual significance of it is the exiting of the carnal mind and entering in, it is full stature, that is what it is.
I believe that it is possible to ascend without going all of the way, I am of the opinion that Peter was not in full stature, I believe he ascended, I believe he was up pretty high, we know he did great miracles, and the reason I do not believe he was in full stature, is that when the Jews came around, he was afraid of them, and he compromised.
Once you are in full stature, I do not believe you would compromise. That is why I do not think the Peter was in full stature, but he was up there, I will take it, he was up pretty high, I will take it.
COMMENT: Is that when that person has that kind of authority to do miracles like Jesus did with such power and authority.
PASTOR VITALE: You mean full stature or where Peter was?
COMMENT: Well even where Peter was, is that a manifestation of being caught up, when we get to that point, we are going to have power to say, Okay go home, your son is healed, and they go home and their son is healed?
PASTOR VITALE: Let me say one more thing to encourage you, and I want to start preaching, it is getting late. Even if we are not caught up all of the way, I believe that in the time that Peter was caught up, there was a ceiling, what I mean is, the apostles were only permitted to be caught up so high because it was not yet the season for the sons of God to manifest. I believe Paul was in full stature, and that his body was offered up because he out of season. What I am saying to you, is that this is the season for full stature, so even if you are only caught up, I believe everybody, when it happens this week or not, I do not know, but when it happens, I believe that everybody, I would be very surprised, this is not prophetic, this is me, but I would be very surprised, I believe I have the Spirit of God, if everybody here were not caught up somewhat. We have to go up, the whole ministry is going up. Does anyone not know what I am talking about?
Even if you are not caught up to full stature, even if I am not caught up to full stature, I believe that after the initial catching up, it will be a continuous ascension until we get there, why? Because this is the season for it, and that the door will be opened. The door is not open now, it is not available right now, the door has to open in heaven, and then it will be a continuous ascension. The Scripture clearly states the door is going to be open for a season and it is going to close, but let us not be carnal now, it could be open for a thousand years, let us be spiritual, we have no idea how long it is going to be open. Remember one day with the Lord is a thousand years down here.
Be very encouraged, be very encouraged, I would expect it to touch everybody here and to not stop there.
COMMENT: Why does it say the hour of His appearing, what does that mean?
PASTOR VITALE: The hour of His appearing, it means the season of His appearing, if one day to the Lord is like a thousand years to man, and there is twenty four hours in a day, so that is still a long period, a spiritual hour is still a pretty long period of time. It is the same kind of thinking, it says, and in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, brethren the twinkling of God's eye, that could be a long time. God's eye, I want to tell you something, God's blink could be centuries, God's blink could be a whole age. I just wound your carnal minds, I wound you! Be spiritual. We will see, what is going to happen, the Feast of Tabernacles is starting not yesterday but this coming Monday, and the Lord went out of His way to correct me.
COMMENT: Is that eight days Sheila?
PASTOR VITALE: It is eight days, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday, Monday through Monday, and the first and the last day we are told are the most important days. Just try and keep your mind open, because it is never the way you think it is going to be. I just pray that whatever you do Lord, that you let everybody see it, I just continue to wound your carnal minds. I ask, well I cannot tell you anything for sure, I hope so, we hope so.
COMMENT: This is about Sukkot, one of the first places that the Israelites came when they came out of...
PASTOR VITALE: So that is true then, it is a thanksgiving for getting through the wilderness.
COMMENT: They came through and it said the first place, and then word is, hidden, covered, set apart.
PASTOR VITALE: Any time you get anything like that, you give the teaching. I encourage you to look to the realm of the spirit, pray that God roll back the eyelid of your carnal mind, and that He let you see because on the day that it happens I believe it is going to touch everybody. Praise God. Thank you Xxxx for that information, I am grateful for it, so that ties in with what the Jews for Jesus newsletter said, I mentioned it to you on the telephone, this morning, that it is the end of the wilderness experience.
COMMENT: I have to say one thing, the Babylonians had called the hill of the daughter or something to this effect, and that when God's people went there, they went there to be cleansed, but the Jews Sukkot was used for (words inaudible).
COMMENT: Is it going to touch people in a different way, like when you...
PASTOR VITALE: Well what do you mean in a different way?
COMMENT: I mean the way it is supposed to touch you, is it going to touch me in the same way as it is going to touch you?
PASTOR VITALE: No, it will be an individual thing, but the basic, the thing that we are all going to have in common is that there will be a spiritual increase, in an understanding of the word, the trumpet, there will also be an increase in tribulation because your carnal mind must go down under the Christ, and those who are advanced enough in both word and in the wounding of their carnal mind will move out from their carnal mind into Christ. It all depends on where you are, but I believe that when this door opens, wherever you are, you will start to ascend and it will be a continuous ascension, however long it takes, so be encouraged.
I keep telling the Lord, I hope it is me, but if it is not me, it does not matter, just let somebody stand up, because as soon as there is, I do not think it will be just one person, as long there is a group no matter how small, of men who have attained this in this world, there will be a measure of power available to us that we do not have now. They are going to drag us up by the bootstraps. Just let somebody do it already, let is happen. When it happens, that is the opening of the womb, I guess the womb actually was opened with Jesus, I cannot exactly explain it to you, but it is like the head coming out of the womb, when one person stands up, we are all coming through. There will be a mind in the earth that is the fullness of God, doing what?
Opposing all of the forces that are keeping us down, joining with us to help us to wound our carnal mind and to increase Christ in us. There is going to be an outpouring of power associated with this increase that is coming, there is going to be an outpouring of power that will be available on all levels depending where you are, but where the power is coming from, brethren the power is not pouring out of the sky, there is no such thing as free floating spirits, and neither is God a free floating spirit. God is in man, and the demons are in man, spirit is inside of their house which is us.
When this power comes pouring out we are told in Revelation, I believe it is chapter 15, not too clear in the King James, but the saints, they were filled up with the wrath of God, the wrath of God being the passion of God. What passion? The passion that by which He wants to possess all of humanity. When the sons of God stand up in full stature, they are going to be so filled up with Him, that He is going to come overflowing out Him, like a flood, and it is going to be an outpouring of spiritual power coming out of the mind and the mouth of those that are spiritually mature, full stature and I guess if they are people in the condition that Peter was in, I do not have the details, but that is where the power is coming from, out of the men in whom Christ is so manifested that the vessel cannot even contain Him, and He is going to come pouring out, and everybody that gets touched this time is not going to just get their body healed and then die forty years later, they are going to get their body healed and they are going to get their spirit healed and they are not going to die. It is a much greater manifestation than when Jesus was here. Do not manifest, any Pharisees hearing this, Jesus said, You will do greater works, all you religious spirits out there.
COMMENT: Do you feel within you that you are praying not only for us but for every person over the whole world?
PASTOR VITALE: Oh, yes.
COMMENT: I did not have that like that before.
PASTOR VITALE: Oh, it is not just for us, see there is...
COMMENT: Yeah, but it is such a strong thing, that now you are praying really Lord bring all of the sons up, from all over the world, and I never had that before.
PASTOR VITALE: Leviathan has seven heads, Leviathan is the root of everything, Leviathan is really the carnal mind, is really not a demon, he is the carnal mind, and there is a dragon in the sea that means his head is cut off and he needs to be slain, he is not cast out. You can have demons of pride, if you are a very proud person and you yield to that pride, and it is on your family line, there may be some demons of pride cast out, but you will never cast out pride completely, he needs to be overcome and swallowed up by Christ, he is your carnal mind, he is your natural man. Let us try and preach this tonight. Glory to God.
COMMENT: Should we fast Sheila?
PASTOR VITALE: Well if you feel led you can fast, I do not fast from food, I fast from a lot of other things. I have not been able to fast from food. If you want to fast from food, you can fast for food as long as you understand that fasting from food is not fulfilling the Scripture that says afflict your soul.
The true fast is to fast from your carnal mind. Some people say when they fast from food, it helps them to be more spiritual, and fasting is supposed to be good for your health, I have no problem with fasting, unless you think that fasting is the answer to everything, then you have a problem.
You do not know that he fasted from food, you do not really know what that means. The truth is we really do not know what that means, it says he fasted, but we really do not know what it means. We do not know what the desert is either, maybe the desert was the wilderness of the soul realm.
Personally, I do not think He was out in any desert, I think the wilderness was the wilderness of the soul realm and that He fasted from the things of this world, and He fasted from His carnal mind. He withdrew from His carnal mind, would not fornicate with it, would not listen to it, would not yield to it, took utter dominion over it, wounded it continuously. The desert means that He was in the spirit.
Remember it is a spiritual book and what happened to Jesus was a spiritual experience. We are not going to enter in, in the flesh, we are going to have to understand the spiritual significance of what happened to Jesus, because it is going to happen to us. If we are going to have a similar experience to Jesus, what are we going to do, there is no desert around here, so it is with the desert of the soul realm. He went into spiritual matter.
I knew someone was going to get me on that, yeah, God is not a free floating spirit, God is everything, God is everything, He is not a spirit floating out there, God is totally woven through this whole world system, He is totally woven through all men, and He is beyond this world, He is not a free floating spirit, He is all there is. What I meant by that was, that is a good point, but what I meant to say, I guess I did not make it clear, what I meant to say is the manifestation of God to men is not as a free floating spirit that has entered into this world, He enters into this world through men.
He does not come from up there and descend, it is a big confusion, God has to help us to get spiritual, these bodies and our souls are houses for spiritual life, they are houses, they are cities for spiritual life, it is very clear in the Scripture if you have an open mind, it is there, and the spiritual life both of the Father and of the living soul is dwelling inside of these bodies, inside of these minds. There are no free floating spirits out there, they arise up out of their cities, they exit their city, and they can, there is no time or space in the realm of the spirit, they can appear on the other side of the world, and they can appear to be a free floating spirit, because that is what they want us to believe, by some measure they are attached to somebody's mind, they are attached to somebody's mind. If it is a demon or if it is Christ, they have come out of the city that they dwell in, to perform some function in this world system.
COMMENT: But that city can be an animal right?
PASTOR VITALE: I do not know, I do not think so.
COMMENT: Because they wanted to go into the pigs.
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah, but it did not work, the pigs died, they could not do it. I believe that demons are thoughts, demons are thoughts of people, so I do not see how they could be rooted in an animal. Sometimes we get demonized animals, I have heard about that, but I have never really thought about it before, but my immediate reaction is, that the demons have come out of somebody's mind perhaps their owner, someone who has a soul tie with the dog, and the dog is being harassed by the demon, that does not mean the demons are rooted and dwelling in the animal, they are still in a man's mind.
Evil brethren, is a manifestation of the fallen living soul, animals are not evil. There is no potential to produce evil coming from animals. (Words inaudible). Yeah, well she said demonized, but I really do not have any answers for you on this, but it is my understanding right now that demons are human thoughts, evil human thoughts and what happened to that horse, was that it was abused, horses do have souls, horses do have souls, they do not have spirits, but they do have souls, they are the same kind of soul that we have, the difference between us is that we also have a human spirit.
That soul can be wounded, and that soul can be hurt, and when you are wounded badly enough, it can make you crazy. Abused people are the most asocial people in the world, they do not function in society, people, the people living in the streets, the people that are the worst members of this society, they are hurt wounded, devastated people that our society does not have the strength to heal, but their souls have been devastated, like the Gadarene demoniac, but that does not mean that they have demons, because demons are the product of a spirit. Demons are a product of the mind of man which has a spirit, animals do not have a spirit, demons are the product of Satan, and the fallen living soul, I am sorry, they are the product of Eve fornicating with her carnal mind, which is a product of Satan and Eve which is spirit, demons are half spirit and half soul, they are bastards.
The fruits of God's Spirit, are all spirit, demons are bastards, half spirit, half soul. Animals do not have a spirit, therefore they cannot produce demons, but their soul can be wounded to the point where they are crazed from the pain, and that is all I could give you, I do not have any more information, and I have a whole message to preach, so I really have to start preaching, but did I satisfy you for now? I hope so.
Let us try Ephesians 4, (phone rings), well maybe I should let it go, maybe I am not supposed to preach Ephesians 4 tonight, let us just wait on the Lord and see. I am not going to try an force it. Let us just wait, if I ask for more questions then you can ask it. Yeah, okay, go ahead and ask your question.
COMMENT: How can they have fear then?
PASTOR VITALE: Fear does not have to be a demon, it is a condition of the soul man. Fear is a condition of the man without God, so if it is an animal without God he has fear.
COMMENT: Going back to fasting and Jesus, you mean when He fasted forty one days?
PASTOR VITALE: Forty days.
COMMENT: Forty days, you mean He was not really in a desert when He was fasting, in a natural desert?
PASTOR VITALE: I do not think so, I believe He ascended into a spiritual place that is called the desert. The soul ream is the desert, the realm of God's Spirit is the Garden of Eden, He did not ascend to God's Spirit, He ascended into the realm of the soul where He had a face to face encounter with the god of that world, which is Satan.
COMMENT: When it talks about desert in Matthew, are you saying it is not referring to a natural desert?
PASTOR VITALE: Well, I do not know, actually whether or not Jesus went out into a natural desert, but if He did go out into a natural desert, the encounter that He had with Satan was in the spirit, definitely, and in my opinion although I have no way to prove it to you, I would expect that He did not go out in to a natural desert, that would be my opinion, but I do not even think it is important, the only thing that is important is that whether He did or not, the encounter with Satan was not in Bethsheba which is the desert, the encounter with Satan was in the spiritual desert which is the soul.
The desert is the place where there is no rain, spiritually speaking the rain typifies the Spirit of God, in the realm of the soul. The desert or the wilderness place is the realm of the soul where there is no rain, the desert is the spiritual place of separation from God. There is a however a soul realm where there is rain, and this is in the soul life of Christ.
PRAYER: Help us Lord. Help us to be spiritual Lord, that we might serve you in the Spirit, let us go out from Egypt Father, that we might worship our God away from the idols of Egypt, outside of the camp Lord, let us worship you in spirit and in truth, let us understand in spirit and in truth, and let us ascend from the wilderness into Eden, dear God. Thank you Father.
Let me just show you this on the board. This is Eden and our innermost being, where our spirit is, this is our carnal mind and this is our human body, this is the wilderness. Most people in this world including Christians are dwelling out here, the world is very carnal brethren, even the church is, and I do not mean to insult anybody. This is where we are living, how did we get out here? We were propelled out here by the curse that God pronounced upon the Serpent. He said, Ye shall from here on in, you shall go on your belly. If you look that word up in the Hebrew, what it means is, you are going to live in the outer realms, that is what it meant, that is what it means if you look it up in the Hebrew. The whole population is out here. Ideally, we want to get back to Eden right? We are on a journey, this Egypt out here brethren, this world is Egypt, if you have been taught that you came out of Egypt when you stop going to bars and starting going to church, well think again, because you are still very much in Egypt, you are living out here, in this world, you are living in your flesh.
We want to get back to Eden, and we have started, those of us who have, have started on a journey towards spiritual things, and the spiritual world is within. We started on a program of praying and seeking God, of exercising spiritual gifts, prophecy, speaking in tongues, and this is all part of our journey back towards being a spiritual person. The first place we reach brethren, is the desert, that was outside of Egypt, it is another name for the soul ream, where the carnal mind exists, and let me remind you that with the carnal mind is Satan. We are on this journey, and the more God has stripped from us, the more we are in the desert.
God stripped a lot from me, I am in the desert. You can ask God how much He has taken from you, and how much you are in the world, do not get condemned, do not get upset, just know the truth, ask the Lord, where are you, are you over here, are you over here, are you over here? You have to know where you are if you want to go forward right? We all know we are not over here, I know I am not over here. I say, Turn to wine and it does not listen to me. I know I am not over here, I still got water in the glass. How do I know I am not over here, that is how I know I am not over here. This world does not listen to me. I am telling you the truth. No lie ever brought forth spiritual growth in your life. I am the righteousness of God. Oh really? What is wrong with these people?! No wonder the world laughs at us. God help us.
We are on a journey and this is our goal, Eden, and we know that we have cherubim on the outskirts of Eden and those cherubim are fire. In order to get into Eden, everything is going to burn up, except, well this is the Spirit of Christ. If we want to get in here as we go through the fire, everything is going to burn except our human spirit. This is the lake of fire brethren. The Christ that is arising in us is taking us right towards this fire and we are screaming and yelling every step of the way, because no one in their right mind jumps into the fire. We found out when we did the #78 series, that the Christ in us is throwing us in, He is living in the innermost part of our being, and in that innermost part of our being has the strength to direct us right into the fire, we saw it happen with you know what happened Sunday, God brought someone against their will, they do not even know how they got there, but Christ within them brought them right into the fire that is in this ministry.
Does anybody not understand or are you still having a problem with this wilderness experience? Jesus, what happened after He was baptized and we still have one more message on that series, if I can recall you to JESUS IN THE JORDAN, we found out that when Jesus went under the water of baptism, that at that point that He went down, He was just a natural Jew, that He did not become spiritual until He was baptized in the Jordan by John the Baptist, and He had a series of spiritual experiences at that time that is taking us many years to have, it happened to Him all at once, He was baptized with the Holy Spirit, His human spirit stepped out and separated itself from His carnal mind, joined with the Holy Spirit, He stood up in full stature, His spiritual sight was restored to Him and right after that, He was caught up, driven up into the wilderness by the spirit.
After He stood up in full stature, or is part of the process of Him standing up in full stature, He was driven inward to the wilderness of His carnal mind. And because He overcame Satan, and the carnal mind in this wilderness He continued into Eden. This wilderness experience was a part of his standing up in full stature, you are not going to stand up in full stature without going through the wilderness.
Everybody knows you have got to be water baptized, everybody knows you have to be baptized with the spirit, and we are not baptized with the spirit here, we have received the spirit here, so we are going to have to be baptized with the spirit, and what does that mean? It is a greater anointing. How will we know? There is going to be power on us, and very likely we will be speaking in other tongues, not in new tongues but in other tongues, other known languages, and then after we do that, we are going to have a nose to nose confrontation with Satan, and we are going to defeat him and we are going to march right on past the cherubim into Eden, and we shall in full stature.
It may not be in that order. I received the Holy Ghost before I was water baptized, and I might be mistaken but I am of the opinion that I have more than one nose to nose confrontations with Satan, I could be wrong, but that is my opinion right now.
I have not been baptized with the Holy Spirit, I have just received the Holy Spirit, I do not have the authority that apostles had when they were baptized with the Holy Spirit, and I have never spoken in other tongues.
Not only does it not have to happen in that order, but even more likely than that, is that all of these things are happening at once. Remember this is the realm of the spirit, everything is happening at once, all mixed up, all overlapping and overflowing. I have been baptized with the Holy Spirit, but it did not abide. I have been up very high for a specific purpose, God had specific ministry for me. He wants to heal somebody and several other times to do deliverance, it has happened quite a few times to me. I was baptized with the Holy Spirit, but it did not abide, and what did John the Baptist say, the one that has sent me to baptize with water, the one upon whom the spirit abides, he is the one who is the son of God. I was the son of God for that moment, but it did not abide.
COMMENT: During your time in Christ you come in measures of these things right?
PASTOR VITALE: Yes, that is the way it looks to me. You will have a series of experiences all working together in many different levels, doctrine, various spiritual experiences, God is squeezing it all together, He can do anything He wants, He can change the order around, resists religious bondage, He can do anything He wants, and do not think that because He did it one way with you, that, that is how He is going to do it with somebody else, because then you are putting yourself in bondage and you are putting the other person in bondage. God is not doing the exact same thing with everybody, why? Because in each individual, we are a different group of variables. God could be doing, let me change that, God could be doing the same exact thing to everybody in this room and the results will be different, because He is doing the same thing upon different people that are have had different experiences, and the end result could be radically different for each of us.
Be very careful not to assumed that what God did for me, He is going to do the same thing for you. I have had a terrible life, do assume you are going to have a terrible life. Do not do that to yourself. Do not assume that what you are experience was is going to happen to me, because it is not healthy to do that. You have to remain open and ask God to keep our eyes open and our understanding open, because everybody is different.
COMMENT: ...that it does not necessarily mean that when you get baptized with the Holy Ghost that the mark of it is being able to speak with other known languages, that is not necessarily the mark?
PASTOR VITALE: I believe that is the mark, not to receive the Holy Ghost, to be baptized with the Holy Ghost...
COMMENT: But you said you were baptized with the Holy Ghost a couple of times with the anointing.
PASTOR VITALE: And I did not speak with other languages, is that what you mean?
COMMENT: Yeah, so I am saying, so that is not the mark then, that's...
PASTOR VITALE: Well, I do not know, that is a good question, if you asked me, I would say that is the mark. The only answer that I have for you and I am not a hundred percent sure, is that when the apostles were baptized with the Holy Ghost, I believe that it did abide upon them, but they were not in full stature. In my case, it was an isolated incident for ministry to a particular person, and maybe it was not long enough for God to give me that witness. I do not know, but I know I was up really high.
COMMENT: Could you explain what you mean about other tongues?
PASTOR VITALE: Other tongues, okay, we have a tape, if you would like to try and listen to it on the truth about baptism, and we found out that when Paul in one Scripture said other tongues and another Scripture he said new tongues, that he was not confused about what word he was using, and that there are three different kinds of tongues. New tongues are tongues that nobody ever heard of before, that is what you hear speaking amongst the Christians today. Other tongues are known languages, the apostles spoke other known languages when they were baptized with the Holy Spirit, we have received the Holy Spirit, it is like the former rain as compared to the latter rain, it is a lesser anointing, and the mark of having received the Holy spirit, is to speak in new tongues, that nobody recognizes, and the mark of the latter rain, the outpouring of the Holy Spirit, is to speak in other tongues, known languages, which are recognized by other men, that is the greater anointing. The third tongues is the gift of tongues which we will see manifesting in a group meeting which needs to be interpreted, three different kinds of tongues. Did I answer your question.
COMMENT: I am just a little confused about the tongues, because if you are speaking on tongues, nobody understands it, if you were to speak in another language, and if I do not have, you know, I do not know that language, it still would be no knowledge to me.
PASTOR VITALE: Well, God will have different purposes for each gift. The speaking in other languages when it happened to the apostles, there were men of those nations present, and I have heard of cases of it happening, where there was someone who did not speak English and God wanted to talk to them, so the person that was manifesting this gift, spoke their language, without any human knowledge of it. That is why when you get into the books of Corinthians, where Paul is saying, Well if you talk in tongues, they will think you are mad, and if you go through that whole Scripture, you will see that there is a contradiction there, and we found out that the reason there was a contradiction there, was that Paul was talking about two different kinds of tongues. If a stranger, if a heathen walks into a church meeting, and someone speaks in other tongues, that is their language, Chinese, or Indian, or whatever, they will say of a truth, God is in this place, and they will be convicted and receive the Lord.
Paul says, But if they come in and everybody is babbling in new tongues, they will think you are all mad. When you look that passage up in Greek, it is the same Greek word for new tongues, and for other tongues, the same Greek word, and when we went through the Scripture, we found that, that was what he was talking about. Yeah, it is a good tape, if you want to borrow it some day you should try it, it is a good tape, it is a very interesting tape, because there is a lot of myths surrounding baptism today, a lot of false teaching surrounding that.
COMMENT: When you went through that experience, would you call that the imputed anointing or would that be an imparted anointing?
PASTOR VITALE: It was, we found out in a recent tape that it was, what did we say it was? It was a greater manifestation of the imputed anointing. Today we have the lesser manifestation of the imputed anointing, there was a greater manifestation of the imputed anointing upon natural Israel, upon the prophets, when the Spirit of God grabbed their minds, and they prophesied it was totally without error, because the law said, if they said one thing that did not come to pass, you have to stone them to death. We have a lot of false prophecy in the church today.
It is not so terribly uncommon, and the pastor will correct it, no one gets stoned to death. Why, what is the difference? The difference is that under the old covenant, let me remind you, under the old covenant, the Jews did not grow up into spiritual men from childhood. Let me say it again, under the old covenant, the Jewish men that were involved in this covenant with God, did not grow up and become spiritual men from childhood, one day the Holy Ghost fell on them and they received an anointing from God that enabled them to do many things, one of the things was that they gave them wisdom to build a tabernacle, it gave them the wisdom that they needed, it gave the priesthood the wisdom they needed, it imparted wisdom to the prophets to prophesy without error, because it was God's own law, they were a false prophet and they have to die.
There was no understanding. We are clearly told in the New Testament that the prophets of old had no idea what they were talking about, they wanted to know but they had no idea what they were talking about. They were vessels for the Spirit of God which can be likened today to a occult experiences called channeling, where you are just a vessel and a spirit talks through you, you have no understanding at all, we see it in the church in the form of prophecy and tongues and interpretation of tongues. This wisdom is not coming from the individual bringing it forth, it is the Holy Spirit that has seized their minds and their vocal chords and is speaking through them. Can anyone not say amen to that.
They had a manifestation of the imputed anointing, that was greater than we have today, did I answer your question? When that happened to me, it was a greater manifestation of the imputed anointing, I still had no knowledge, I was possessed of the Holy Spirit, utterly possessed of the Holy Spirit, He did whatever He wanted in a couple of the instances, I was very aware that my personality had been pushed to the background. It was a very strange experience, it was almost as if I was behind a wall, I was behind a wall, it was as if it would be as if in the natural, some big person came over and pushed me back against the wall, and stood in front of me and was doing all of the talking, and I was very aware that my vocal chords were being used, that my body was being used, and I was a complete observer, had nothing to say about it at all. That is the imputed anointing.
The imparted anointing which is what God is offering to the church today, is the opportunity to become a spiritual man through experiences that can be likened to growing up from a young child, and therefore when His Spirit flows through us, it will be with our understanding, and with our agreement, and the basic spiritual difference is, with the imputed anointing, the carnal mind is covered over and crushed down so that it cannot move, with the imparted anointing, the mind of Christ is woven together with the carnal mind, woven together with the carnal mind.
You are not going to be pushed into the background like I was, you are going to be right up there in the front with the Lord, the two of you, your minds will be one, you will understand and you will be in agreement. You are getting, your mind is coming into this condition because God is giving you many experiences in Christ Jesus, He is letting you make mistakes, even the people that are prophesying false prophesies, He is letting that person find out, your carnal mind overtook you, and He is letting the other people in the church learn to discern a false prophecy.
Everybody is learning, the church is having spiritual experiences, we are being instructed as spiritual children, and there is much to learn and the end result will be that we will Lord willing be full grown spiritual men. The way the Scripture expresses it is that Israel came into being as a full grown ram. We know that Jesus said, we are the sheep of His pasture, a ram is a male sheep. Israel is male, because Christ is ruling in her, she was never a baby sheep, from the day that the Lord possessed her, she was a full grown man. We in the church today, we are growing up from seed, we are lambkins, we are babies.
The end of us is going to be something greater than Israel had the opportunity of attaining to. If you look at it on the surface right now, this is not a popular teaching, something else I am teaching that is not popular, but I am telling you the truth, that the anointing of God upon natural Israel was greater than the anointing on the church today.
I can hear them screaming in the spirit, I am telling you the truth, I am telling you the truth, it was much greater than the anointing on the church today. We are growing up from seed, and we are not typified by a full grown ram, we are typified by a lambkin, a baby lamb, and the end of us will be greater than natural Israel was, but of course natural Israel is going to be grafted back into the tree, and they will have their opportunity also, but the end of this dispensation will be greater than that which Israel achieved.
We are told in the prophets that they brought forth wind, what does that mean? I have to laugh, do you remember what he used to preach about that? Do you remember. He used to preach that Israel brought forth gas, now that is not what it means brethren, that is not what it means. It means that they were a spiritual, well Xxxx use to preach that, God help us.
What that Scripture means that they brought forth wind, it means that they brought forth an empty spirit. Brethren, you know I had a letter from someone in California not too long ago, saying, You are out of your mind, you know where is all of this sexuality in Christ, you must be out of your mind. No, I am not out of my mind, God is having a son. The offspring of God is the mind of Christ in a man that previously had a carnal mind, the son of God is a new mind in you. Israel never produced the son of God. They had a temporary manifestation of Christ that came upon them strictly in accordance with the will of God, at any given moment, they had nothing to say about it, for God's specific purpose, but they never brought forth the son, they never joined with that spirit permanently, and produced an offspring, the Spirit of Christ, that anointing that abides forever and ever, it never happened to them.
What the prophet says in his prophecy is that he did not bring forth the Spirit of Christ, you brought forth wind, you brought forth emptiness, you brought forth nothing. We have had several Scriptures here where we have found in Isaiah and in other prophets that it is a common expression of the Lord to save a natural man, he is as nothing to me. We have just had it in a study of Daniel 10, we have had it Isaiah, God sees the natural man as nothing, He sees him as emptiness, it is all through the prophets. When the prophet says you brought forth wind, you brought forth a spirit that does not even exist, you did not bring forth Christ.
I would like to make something clear to you that God is drawing the whole world, and He is taking us in groups, He is not drawing everybody the same way. He started out for His purposes with natural Israel, and He is drawing them or He drew them by making a covenant with them, that we call the old covenant, which involved animal sacrifices and very burdensome rituals. Now He is dealing with the rest of the world and there is a new covenant, well not really the new covenant, this is very important, the covenant that is in the church today, do not shut off the tape, I am telling you the truth, it is not the new covenant that is going to give us eternal life, the covenant that is in the church today is God's dealings with the Gentile. God has dealt with natural Israel with the law, and He is dealing with the Gentiles with the law of the Holy Spirit.
The new covenant will be for both Israel and the church when we grow up to be ready for it. I want to say it again, let me put it on the board for you, it is very important, there is a new covenant by which we inherit eternal life, there are two groups of people in the world, the Gentile and the Jew, I think there is a Scripture, I think it is in Romans where Paul says, the Jew is coming by the law and the Gentile is coming through the law, something like that. The Jew is getting to the new covenant of eternal life through the law of Moses. The Gentile is being prepared to approach the new covenant of eternal life through the law of the Holy Spirit, one covenant to the Jew, and another covenant to the Gentile, and the both of them will arrive at the new covenant which imparts eternal life together.
That is why the natural Jew has been put on hold, until the age of the Gentiles is fulfilled, and the Jews are going to be grafted back into their tree and together they are going to go up the mountain of the Lord and receive eternal life. One covenant to the Jew and another covenant to the Gentile. We are not in the new covenant right now. You hear it preached all over the place, you are in the new covenant, no you are not, you are under grace, no you are not, unless Christ is being formed in you, the grace of God is Christ. If He is not being formed in you, you are not under the grace of God, you under the law of the Holy Spirit. That is a very hard word.
Brethren it is not true that if you sin all you do is say, I plead the blood of Jesus, and you are forgiven, that is not true, because there is a product of your sin, there is an offspring of your sin, you are not truly forgiven until you have been, your spirit has been cleansed and any offspring has been purged out of you. There is a Scripture that says, the Lord will remember your sins no more. Brethren, after He squeezes you through the ringer, and gets every last vestige out of you, He is not going to remember it anymore. He is not going to look at you as filthy as you are, and say, Well you are under the blood, you are clean. That a lie that is being preached in the church.
We cannot continue to sin. Sin shall not enter into the kingdom of God, corruption brother, shall not inherit incorruption.
I am going to put to you another way, the natural Jew, who did not have his spirit cleansed, who did not have the demons purged out of him, has been acceptable to God because of the sacrifice of animals, and was therefore eligible for the cleansing that will permit him to enter into eternal life. The members of the church today, who are not being cleansed, who are not having the demons purged out of them, are made acceptable to God because of the presence of the firstfruits which is the Holy Spirit, they are both filled with sin, in their spirit and in their soul, and both groups of people, must be spiritually cleansed before they can ascend up to the new covenant.
Both groups of people are natural people filled with sin, totally given over to their carnal mind, living out of their carnal mind, who are justified before God because the Lord has made a covenant with them, saying, If you do what I tell you, I will receive you, but both groups are still spiritually filthy, and both groups are going to have to enter into the spiritual new covenant, they are going to have to listen to the trumpet blow, they are going to have to receive the truth of this word, because Jesus said to the Pharisees, If you believe the truth, I will tell you the truth and I will set you free. They said, What truth, you will teach us, what do you make yourself? Both groups of people are denying the true message, they both are going to have to repent, and hear the trumpet sound, both groups of people are denying the affliction of their soul, they think fasting from food is going do it, fasting from food is not going to do it, your carnal mind must be wounded and destroyed, very few people are doing it today, I do not think the Jews are doing it at all, very few Christians are doing it today.
There is two requirements to enter into the Feast of Tabernacles, believing the doctrine and spiritual cleansing. When you wound your carnal mind brethren, the demons will come out. There is a preparation for the Feast of Tabernacles, which is the transference of the human spirit into the safety of Christ, and the two groups of people in the world, the natural Jew and the Gentile have both been justified before God by different covenants and now God is gathering them together in the valley of Armageddon, to wound their souls, so that they might ascend up into the mountain of the Lord. Does anyone not know what I am talking about?
I feel to say it one more time, two groups of people, Jew and Gentile, both given a covenant by God which justifies them before God, each one a different covenant, the Jew is justified before God, in a different way than the Gentile is justified before God. Both covenants are temporary, and there must be a spiritual cleansing and a receiving of the truth, for both groups have to go through the same spiritual cleansing and the same truth, to enter into the new covenant which is eternal life in Christ.
The church today preaches that you are in the new covenant now, no you are not. Brethren, the new covenant is Christ. If you have the Holy Spirit, you do not have Christ, there is no way you are in the new covenant. If you have Christ and you are not living out of Him, there is no way you are in the new covenant. If you have Christ and you are not wounding your carnal mind, you are not in it. To be in the new covenant, Christ must be ruling in your mind, or at least in the process of. You must be in the war! To be in any measure entering into the new covenant, you have got to be in the war, and you really have not entered into the new covenant until you stand up in full stature.
Brethren, the new covenant is full stature. The church is not in the new covenant. The new covenant is full stature. I heard Pat Robertson on the tv the other day, he said he saw the statistics for sin in the church, and in the world, he said, Adultery, fornication, every sin you can imagine, the statistics are exactly the same for the church as for the world. The church is filled with sin, do not tell me you are in the new covenant. The new covenant is full stature, and eventual glorification. The new covenant is full stature, the church is not in the new covenant, it is in a different covenant than the Jew, but a covenant that can be likened to the covenant that God made with the Jew, justification of a sin filled carnal man. It is not the new covenant. Hallelujah.
COMMENT: Will the Gentiles come in before the Jews to the new covenant, is that not the way it goes, that they will be jealous of the perhaps of the full stature of the Gentiles, and this will bring the Jews in?
PASTOR VITALE: I do not think so, I have not looked at that Scripture in a while, but I do not think so, I think the jealousy is not the new covenant, but the covenant that exists in the church today. I want to tell you that it has been my experience that I do not know if jealousy is the word, maybe that is what it is, but they are very angry at the church. They are very angry, at least from the few that I have met, they believe that they are the guardians of the word, and that they have been studying the word for years and who are we to think that we could preach it, who are we to think that we have a knowledge of it, but they are not jealous of the new covenant, they are jealous of the covenant that God has made with the unregenerate church. Did I answer your question? I do not think that we will enter in ahead of them, that is not my understanding, my understanding is that when the time for full stature arrives, that we will enter in together, both groups will enter in together. That is my understanding.
I found out today that the head attorney for Pat Robertson's Center for Law and Justice is Jewish. The head attorney who is winning all kinds of cases of Pat Robertson's organization, The American Center for Law and Justice, is a Jewish Christian, Jewish lawyer in the church.
COMMENT: You know where it says, ye are, or we are complete in Christ, is that prophetic, what does that statement mean?
PASTOR VITALE: Well it is a promise, we did that recently.
COMMENT: It is a promise so it is prophetic then.
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah, we did that recently, that is either Ephesians 2 or 3, we just that recently, you can review the tape if you like. Yeah, it is a promise, we are complete in Christ, but it has to happen to you. It is in the heavenlies, it has to happen inside of you. Brethren, you can be married, you can be sleeping with your husband every night, you are not pregnant until you are pregnant, and even when you are pregnant, you do not have a baby until you have a baby. Ask anyone that has had children, any married woman, your pregnant one month, you are pregnant two months, you are pregnant three months, a lot of women will not even furnish the nursery until the baby is born. It has to happen to you, the whole church is in a condition of fantasy. The psychiatrists would call it hysteria.
COMMENT: Today we do not see the miracles, you know, in Paul's day, Peter and John that used to go around healing people and casting out demons, they would have that power, Christ in them, how come we do not see that today?
PASTOR VITALE: Because there is a lesser anointing in the church today. Once again, the anointing that was poured out at the time of the apostles was an anointing that can be likened to a mature spiritual man, the apostles did not grow up from seed. I think Paul did, but I do not even know about that, to tell you the truth, I am not even sure about that, but it was the anointing that came upon them, it was a gift, it was poured out, it was known that it would not be permanent, Jesus knew it would not be permanent, it was like saying, what Jesus was saying, was, Brethren, I want you to see a demonstration of what the promise is going to be, this is what you are going to be like when you are a full grown man, and now I am leaving the earth and the apostles are leaving the earth and I am going to be pouring out of my spirit upon all flesh and I am going to be growing up into the many members of the church from seed, and when I do grow up, this is what I am going to look like in you.
COMMENT: It is the lesser anointing today?
PASTOR VITALE: Yes, because we are growing up from seed, we are growing up from seed. It is a lesser anointing because God's waiting for us to receive understanding and experience.
COMMENT: What is the purpose of the new tongues?
PASTOR VITALE: Well the new tongues are basically a prayer language, sometimes when we do not know what to pray, we can pray in tongues, so it is a comfort to us, but I have experienced occasions where the literally the Christ in me just rises up and prays, and I know that it is not me, it is something inside of me, it is Christ in me just rising up to pray, it is not a comfort to me, it is that He is trying to accomplish something and He is rising up in me and doing it. It is the language of the spirit.
COMMENT: Does Christ have new tongues?
PASTOR VITALE: You mean in the new mind of Christ, is there tongues?
COMMENT: Yeah, does He Himself have new tongues?
PASTOR VITALE: When He is a baby He does, and when He is a full grown man He talks like a full grown man. Can you hear that, Xxxxx use to say that, he used to call tongues, I will explain that, he used to call tongues baby talk, it is the baby talk, well it does not have to be the Christ in you, the Holy Spirit can give you tongues and when Christ is formed in you, He talks baby talk, what does that mean? It means that there a particular situation and you do not know what to pray, and Christ is not ye woven together with your mind enough that you can evaluate the situation and know what to do and know what to pray. The baby Christ prays in tongues, but as you grow up in Christ and have experiences and teaching in God, in the same circumstance you look at it and you judge it, and you judge it righteously in Christ and you will be able to deal with it, and you will not need tongues because your mind will be manifesting the mind of Christ, and you will know what to do and you will know what to say. The tongues are for when you do not know what to do and you do not know what to say. As you grow up in Christ it will be less and less.
COMMENT: How can you tell when it is the Holy Spirit in you praying those new tongues or it is Christ in you praying those new tongues?
PASTOR VITALE: I am not really sure, the only thing that comes to mind, is that when you do it of your own will, it would be more the Holy Spirit in you, when you do it of your own will, when you call up the tongues in yourself, you would be laying hold of the Holy Spirit to pray in those tongues. But when it is Christ praying in tongues, He will initiate the tongue.
COMMENT: He will override your will?
PASTOR VITALE: It will come through you and you will know that you were not even particularly thinking of it, it will come through you like an automatic reflex.
COMMENT: When we grow up in Christ, will be able to automatically speak every language there is?
PASTOR VITALE: I would think so.
COMMENT: So we will have any tongue we want.
PASTOR VITALE: Well I do not know for sure, but I would think so. Either we would have any language or there would be a form of mind communication, but I believe that in full stature, we should be able to communicate with anyone anywhere.
COMMENT: There is mind communication now right?
PASTOR VITALE: Well yes, it is not too accurate. It is there in some people that are spiritually developed.
COMMENT: But it is covered over right?
PASTOR VITALE: It is not too accurate, I mean I know there are times that I have prayed and asked God to bring someone, but I guess that is not really mind communication, I have asked the Father to do it. When I was in Nigeria, this young man was, he was so funny you know, he was, the communication is very poor there, and he was supposed to come the house where I was staying at on Thursday, and I was not going to be there Thursday and I did not know how to get in touch with him, so I said, Lord, oh he was supposed to come Friday, I said, Lord, please bring him Thursday, I will not be here Friday. I walked in Thursday night and he was there and it turned out that my hostess was having a party, so he was eating something, and he walked over to greet me and he said, Hi, sister Sheila, I do not know why I am here. I said, Well I asked the Lord to bring you. And all of the food fell out of his mouth, all of the food fell out of his mouth (people laughing). That happened several times in Nigeria that I asked the Lord to bring someone, and they came because I did not know how to get in touch with them, and it has happened with you, I have asked the Lord to bring you, and you come. It has been my experience that it would not be likely to happen with Xxxx or with Xxxx or with any of the ladies, why? Because to reach you, all I have to do is pick up the phone.
It has been my experience that God only kicks in supernaturally when the natural fails. When I prayed that prayer for Xxxx she did not have a phone, I could not get in touch with her, but I doubt that it would work for you, He would say, Well pick up the phone, what is your problem?
COMMENT: But I felt that there is a form of mind communication when can pick up another person's thought, and it comes out in your dream or something like that.
PASTOR VITALE: Oh, well that is different.
COMMENT: What is the explanation of that?
PASTOR VITALE: Well what I thought you meant by mind communication is to me to send you a signal, I want to see you instead of the telephone, that was mind communication meant to me, let me just make one more comment on that, I believe that here is a perfect example of the difference between the imputed anointing, this gift in the imputed and the imparted anointing, to use this in the imputed anointing, we would have to say, Father please send them. I have no power to do it.
When this gift starts to manifest, see I do have an imparted anointing but it is immature, there are certain things I can do in the imparted anointing, and certain things that I cannot, to the best of my knowledge I have no authority at all to send a message in the imparted anointing because I tried it and it has not worked. The difference between the imputed and the imparted anointing with this gift is this, Lord please have Xxxx call me, that was the imputed anointing, if it is the imparted anointing, Xxxx come in please I want to see you. I have tried, not necessarily with you, and it has not worked. To me that is mind communication. Now, what you are talking about, to break though in dreams, to the best of my knowledge...
COMMENT: Can I explain this for a second what happened?
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah.
COMMENT: It is that I know that this person, after praying about it and scanning it, I know exactly what happened, that this particular person, somebody at work, this particular person thought a thought towards me, and I know when they thought it, and that night after that, they appeared in the dream and did what they thought, in the dream, and I was shocked, and I came to work and I feel like the Lord, I got the explanation after I worked today, and I said, Lord, I should not have even talked to this person about this, but I feel like it is an ungodly soul tie, that needs to be broken.
PASTOR VITALE: Are they a Christian?
COMMENT: As a matter of fact, the Lord told me that, that ungodly soul tie was going to be broken here tonight.
PASTOR VITALE: Was that person a Christian?
PASTOR VITALE: Oh, so it is definitely witchcraft.
COMMENT: No, they are Muslim, they got a lot of witchcraft, but they appeared. I said, Well when did it get in, you know, and I realized the time that it got in, and I realized that I had opened the door for it. I said, Lord forgive me, I will make sure I will not do that again or open the door for it. But I did talk to them about it, so I have got to have prayer to get this thing broken.
PASTOR VITALE: Okay. It is a reality but I do not really believe it exists in Christ today. I have never seen it, it may exist as an isolated gift, I have heard someone's thought and found out that they were praying that they wanted me to do something, and it is somebody that has a high level of witchcraft. They are a Christian, but my opinion is that it was not done in Christ, I literally heard the word in my mind, but I do not believe it was Christ.
COMMENT: What you were saying before about calling Xxxx and asking her to come in, is that not along the same lines...
PASTOR VITALE: I did not do it with you, but I tried it with other people, and it did not work.
COMMENT: Is that not along the same lines as E.S.P.?
PASTOR VITALE: Well every occult gift has a true counterpart in Christ. I believe we will be able to do that.
COMMENT: And that would not be witchcraft?
PASTOR VITALE: If the spiritual power that you are doing it by is Christ, it is not witchcraft.
COMMENT: You said it was witchcraft but was it mind communication witchcraft, that the person thought the thought and then they entered into your mind and came out in your dream? Did it enter the mind, it had to enter the mind right?
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah, I guess it must be a form of mind control. They all overlap, you know witchcraft and mind control.
COMMENT: Then another example was at work the person that was working with me had me holds the tips for the day, and they went home and I realized that we forgot to split, and so I thought, Well I am going to call the person and let them know I am not holding out on them, I am just going to split it with them or they can come and pick it up if they want or whatever, but I did not get to do that at my second job and it went you know a couple of hours went by, and just as I called them, they thought about it. I called them, and she laughed on the phone, she goes, Oh yes you know, well I will pick it up tomorrow or whatever, and she told me the next day and I said, is that not something, she just, it was as if there was some kind of communication, was it coincidence? I do not know, there is some kind of communication, I picked it up, and said, Well you know I had the money, and I want you to know that I am splitting it with you and etc, and she said, Oh you know, I just thought about that, just at the moment.
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah, well this is all true, it just happened to me tonight, I called my parents before I came over here and it was big joke, and my mother said, Your father was just asking about you, and I told him to leave you alone, you had a meeting tonight, because the last time, she called during the meeting. That cannot possibly be in Christ, because the other person is a heathen.
COMMENT: There is some kind of open line of communication that is real though.
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah, to spiritual sensitive people it happens, but it is not in Christ.
COMMENT: That seemed godly, and so did yours, this last example and so did yours.
PASTOR VITALE: Well I do not know that it is godly, so much is that it is a manifestation of the carnal mind that appears harmless, but it is anything that is not of faith is sin.
COMMENT: Well how could that not be of faith?
PASTOR VITALE: Because it is not of Christ, faith is Christ.
COMMENT: Our examples right now are not of Christ?
PASTOR VITALE: Well, did the person you communicated with have Christ?
COMMENT: I think maybe she is.
PASTOR VITALE: Is she a Christian?
COMMENT: I guess she does not claim to be a Christian.
PASTOR VITALE: So how could she have Christ, she cannot have Christ.
COMMENT: I do not know, you know, I think she believes in the Lord.
PASTOR VITALE: Well it is not likely though, from what you tell me it is not likely that she has Christ. To have that form of mind communication would require a mature Christ. My father certainly does not have Christ. So it is something that did not come out of Christ, it came out of the carnal mind.
COMMENT: Yeah, I can understand that, alright.
PASTOR VITALE: It does not appear to be anything terrible, but it did come out of the carnal mind.
COMMENT: Yeah, it is necessary to see the difference.
PASTOR VITALE: I just want to pray for everybody right here, that any of us that are experiencing this including myself, if it is coming out of the carnal mind, it is witchcraft, if that is what is happening in anybody here, I condemn it, and I curse it and I ask you Lord to seal it off, because we want all of our spirituality to be out of Christ, the old must pass away so that Christ can increase, we must start living out of Christ, and the tendency is to say, Oh, is that not fun? I do it myself, I say, Oh is that not fun, yeah I was thinking about you, is that not interesting. It appears harmless but if it is the carnal mind, it is not harmless, it is witchcraft, the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, so I ask you Father that you move by your Spirit and seal that off, in anybody here in which it is operating, in the name of Jesus.
COMMENT: There was something I was going to talk about, but in reference to what she was talking about, before I was in Christ, years ago, I dialed the number and the number I dialed, that person dialed me, and when I picked the phone up to say hello, they said, Wow, I dialed you, would that be witchcraft right then?
PASTOR VITALE: Were they a Christian?
COMMENT: No, I was not a Christian either.
PASTOR VITALE: Oh, well that is witchcraft yeah.
PASTOR VITALE: It is the spiritual authority of the carnal mind, that appears harmless. It is the good of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, but once Christ comes, He wants to be Lord.
COMMENT: Is what we are talking about, is the carnal mind in the maximum?
PASTOR VITALE: Oh, I doubt that it is in the maximum, (all are laughing), but I would say that it is a spiritual manifestation of the carnal mind but that is just tiddly winks, that is baby stuff.
COMMENT: Sheila, before we were talking about when people stand up in full stature, is one of the things that will happen to them is that they would, God would translate them to other countries, or is that later?
PASTOR VITALE: Well, I think that it happens in full stature because Jesus was on the mountain and then He walked on the water, and He went into the boat.
COMMENT: Do you think that is one of the reasons why they will speak in other tongues, so whatever country God brings them, they will have that language to speak wherever they are put?
PASTOR VITALE: Well I think all of the gifts will work together, I do not really know that they will speak in other tongues, it may be like a telepathy, I do not know, but all of these gifts, I cannot honestly say that is why, but all of this mature spirituality will come together.
COMMENT: Supernaturally you will not even realize probably.
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah.
COMMENT: Talking about in regards to what you were saying before, last week I was, while you were talking to my sister on the phone, when she called you last week and you were talking to her, I was napping at the time, and I remember that I had a dream or something and I remember you being in the dream, and I did not see you, but I heard your voice saying that you had invited me to go somewhere Saturday night, and I just remember you saying something, it felt so real, and you were talking about going somewhere and invited me and my sister to go somewhere Saturday night or something, so I remember my sister coming into my room and I woke up from my nap, and that is when she told me that she spoke to you and you know she told me that she spoke to you. Then she told me that she invited you, this happened for real you know, she told me that you invited her to go somewhere that Saturday night when you called her.
PASTOR VITALE: Well I did not call her, she called me, I was expecting you at my house, if you recall, I was expecting the two of you at my house so I could talk to your sister, and the thought had occurred to me, we might go down to Xxxx for an hour, so I had said that to her on the phone.
COMMENT: When she told me this, I just said to myself, that is funny.
PASTOR VITALE: But you did not come.
COMMENT: No, no, when she told me this, I was saying to myself, while I was sleeping I had a dream that Sheila was saying this. I mean when my sister told me this, I was a little bit shocked.
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah, well see I honestly do not know, at this point, there is an overlapping, I would like to believe that I was in Christ, because I was counseling your sister, so I would like to believe that I was in Christ when I was talking to her, and the only thing, now you have to realize that everything along these lines that I am telling you, I am just giving you my best at the moment, I could be wrong. I am just giving you the best I can, there is a possibility that it was the Lord that wanted her down there, because she really needs to receive Christ, you know she has not really received Christ, you know that, so it is a possibility that you heard me in Christ, that it was not, now if that is true, now if you heard me in Christ, what that would say to me, is that, that was the will of the Lord, that He had wanted you down there that Saturday, but she changed her mind, she decided not to go. That would be my guess.
COMMENT: Why would that happen to me?
PASTOR VITALE: Well you are very spiritually sensitive, and you obviously have an intense soul tie with your sister, and you obviously have a soul tie with me, and if the Lord had a purpose in this plan, that could have been the Lord telling you, Yes Xxxxxx this is my will, I said it and you heard it, to witnesses, but your sister decided not to come, so that was the end of it.
COMMENT: You were talking about mind communication and you were saying, Xxxx was saying about a dream that she had, she was picking up somebody's thoughts, I was thinking I wanted to tell you about what happened to me.
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah, that sounds like Christ to me.
COMMENT: Well I guess you could look at the fruit of the dream right?
PASTOR VITALE: The fruit of the dream was that it was the Lord's will, it did not come to pass because Xxxx did not come, but I think it was the will of God that night.
COMMENT: I do not remember any scenery, I just remember hearing your voice.
PASTOR VITALE: Well you know there is such a gift that you can hear...
COMMENT: When my sister told me this you know, I got a little scared.
PASTOR VITALE: Well there is such a gift you know, Elisha heard what the King of Syria was saying in his bedroom, and I have experienced that. It is one gift, see the occult knows all about these gifts, but the church knows very little about them because the church is carnal. There is a name, I am not too good on the names, but there is one name for hearing a voice inside your head, and then there is another name for hearing a voice outside, I have experienced on three occasions, hearing the voice coming from outside.
On two occasions, it was the man's thoughts that he was not verbalizing, and I heard it as loud as if he had said it, and then there were other occasions that I heard it inside my head and I recognized the voice, and when I heard it inside my head, it was someone who was speaking evil about me, and I got all upset and I went down on my face before God and I said, Dear God, if this is a demon, I cannot, I was all upset, please deliver me. I went into church that night and Win Worley was there and what do you think he preached on? Elisha hearing the King of Syria in his bedroom, and I knew that God was telling me that I had heard, I recognized the voice, and I heard what she said about me, and eventually I found out that it was true.
I will tell you a funny story just to lighten things up here a little bit, it is someone that I love very dearly, I use to go to church with, and she had an experience one day, and told the story. All of a sudden she was sitting in church, and she heard all of these people talking, and they were talking really loud and they were saying bad things you know about the pastor who was preaching and gossip and all kinds of junk, she was sitting there in church saying, What is wrong with these people saying all of these things on the top of their lungs, what is wrong with them, and she turned around and nobody was talking, she was hearing all of their thoughts.
PASTOR VITALE: She was hearing all of their thoughts, and they were all cursing the pastor. See right now it is happening sporadically, every time I have ever heard anyone's thoughts like that, they had been plotting evil against me and God wanted me to know. I have never head someone saying something good about me. Now in Xxxx's case, she heard the will of the Lord, so that is a different circumstance. Every time I ever heard it outside of me, they were plotting evil against me, and the few times I heard it inside they were plotting against me too, plot away brethren, plot away, God will use all of your plans for my good, Hallelujah. Anybody else, did you have a question Xxxx?
COMMENT: It is going back to what Xxxx said about you know knowing the language, I do not know whether it is true or not, but I kind of believe that when a language comes upon you, it is for another person, so I mean yes, we will know every language, it is only when the person needs to hear it.
PASTOR VITALE: Yes. I do believe that at some point the spiritual maturity, it will be telepathy, that we will have the languages as long as we need them, but we will mature out of it, it will be telepathy. It is going to pass away.
COMMENT: What if somebody was trying to read my thoughts like for example, I am thinking about something and a person says, I heard what you were thinking, and I said, What was I thinking? If they say, This is what you were thinking, and I said, No, and it was not true, and they thought they heard my thoughts, and it was not true, you know what I mean, like right now if I say, Sheila you are thinking this, I heard a thought and I thought it was coming from you, and you say, No.
PASTOR VITALE: Well that is a problem because that has happened to me, the Lord from time to time will let me hear somebody's carnal mind and frequently especially with new people that God has brought here, people that are not into spiritual things too much, there is a big wall of denial between their conscious mind and their unconscious mind and God will let me hear their unconscious mind and they do not hear their unconscious mind. That has happened to me, and my famous story is, I mean the things that happen to me are just really, that reminds me of something else that I wanted to share with you, if I forget will you remind me of that question please, I want to share something, the Lord showed me that Jesus' brethren said to Him, Are you coming to the feast? Show yourself in the feast, and He said No, I am not going to Jerusalem to the feast, and the brethren went up without Him, and the Scripture says, And then Jesus secretly went up to the feast. The Lord made a real point of this to me the other day, a carnal minded person would say that Jesus lied. Well I guess He did lie did He not?
He told them that He would not go, and then He went secretly. The Lord made a big point of it to me and that is why I am giving it to you, that when you get into Christ, you start doing things that look bad to the carnal mind, that make no sense to the carnal mind, but there is no sin in Christ, if in fact, it was Christ who told you to do it, there can not be sin in your action, does anybody not know what I am talking about? I thought of that because I wanted to tell you a story, what was your question again, what was I talking about Xxxx?
COMMENT: If someone was trying to read my thoughts...
PASTOR VITALE: Oh yes, okay.
COMMENT: ...and they said they picked up a thought, and I said to them I did not think that thought, I did not say that in my mind.
PASTOR VITALE: So this is this funny story which really was not funny, but there was a woman that God had me ministering to, and that moment of truth always comes where we had a conflict, and I told her something that she did not want to believe was God, and she thought that she forgave me, but from that day forward, every time she would call me, I would hear her carnal mind, and I would start acting out on the telephone what she was thinking. I want to tell you, I would be sitting at my desk on the telephone, going... I said, What is wrong with me, I have got to be losing my mind, I have got to be losing my mind. I would hear four letter words and all kinds of cursing and I have gone through this with several people, who to my face love me, and I pray, pray, and when I first started going through this, I thought it was wickedness in me, and I would pray and pray and rebuke it and resist it, and because of my faithfulness towards God, in view of what I thought was sin in myself, God would explode it in the other person and it would come out into the open, and it would be revealed to me that I was feeling their thoughts towards me, thinking it was mine.
With this woman it went on for about 4 months and then finally the you know what hit the fan, and it came to the surface, and I said, Well I have been waiting you know five months for this, I said, Ever since this day when I told you the truth, you did not like what I said, I said, Your carnal mind has been coming against me with a lot of force, and she was speechless on the phone.
My answer to you Xxxxx is this, the question is, Who was saying this to you? Is it somebody with authority in Christ, that at least you have reason to believe that maybe they know what they are talking about, or is it some heathen, or is it some immature Christian, what is their motive for saying this to you. What I would do in your circumstance if anyone did that to me, I would say, Well I cannot perceive it, but I am willing to pray about it that if it is true God show it to me. With the other person as a minister, I will say to the person, Well, I believe you that you are not aware of it, are you willing to pray about? She would not pray about it, this particular woman, she would not pray with me.
Several people over the years have refused to pray with me. I will never refuse to pray with you over anything you want to say to me, no matter how bad it may sound, what you think about me or what you think about my motives, I will pray publicly that if it is true that God reveal it beyond a shadow of a doubt in the mouth of two or three witnesses, let all things be made manifest. If you think you see this wickedness in me, let it be revealed publicly, and I say that to you in all honesty, because if it is true, I do not want it.
That is how I would deal with it, I would say to the person, Well I understand that, that is your perception, I cannot really see it right now, but I am very willing to pray that if it is true God show it to me. Then change the subject, and if they will not drop the subject then you are dealing with witchcraft and you have to put them in their place. That is how I deal with it, and this is a real problem as you mature in Christ, you are going to find this a real problem, that people exist and people dwell on different levels of consciousness.
I know I went through this with Xxxx, for years he would tell me that I was crazy, we had a standing joke, we were going to put a tape recorder in a hidden place to find out who, I was saying, You would say this, and he said, No I never said that, you are out of your mind, I never said any such thing, and it was not until years later that I realized that I was looking in to a depth of him that he could not see, he could not perceive his own motives. As we mature in Christ, we are going to come up against this more and more, and when someone is approaching you, you humble yourself and you publicly ask God to reveal the truth, that is how you deal with it, but, you tell the person that you cannot see at this time, because if it is an ungodly motive in them, you do not want to take it taking authority over you, you have got to get your witness from God. You as ministers, as you are up and coming sons of God, you are going to be finding this, and it is important that you understand that as the gifts develop in you and as you grow up in Christ, you are going to be seeing things in people that they honestly do not know were there.
How do you deal with that? Brethren you tuck it away and you do not open your mouth until God tells you now the time. You know, you talk to the Lord about it, take it to the Lord in prayer, you might have to hold on to that knowledge for a year, and if you go to that person to expose that sin in them before God sends you, you could do a lot of damage, you could turn them away from God.
Brethren, everything has to be in God's time. Everybody is not prepared to deal with every sin at any one given moment, and if you have a deep perception, you may be seeing things that God is not going to deal with for another 3 years, so why would you want to break somebody's heart. You just put it away, and you wait until God opens a door for ministry in this area to this person, and believe me, if God has let you see this area of sin in their life, He is going to open that door as fast as He can, because He wants ministry for that person, but you must let Christ take the lead, as to the time and the place and the circumstances, and as to how you present it to them, you must bend over backwards to not condemn them, but present it in the manner that is going to bring deliverance in their life. What have you gained, if you condemn you kill them.
Being a son is a great responsibility, and when you see the sin in them, the Lord requires you to love them despite what you see, and to just hold it in your heart as a secret until the time of their deliverance in this area, it is a great responsibility.
I think what you were talking about where people coming to you and saying that to you, it could be witchcraft, do not let anyone take authority over you, unless you are really sure that it is Christ in that person, be careful about that, because it is all over the place. As you ascend in Christ, the carnal mind is going to manifesting wherever he can manifest, to take authority over Christ, he is going to be coming through people that do not even know what they are doing.
He is going to be coming through everyone's carnal mind, you are going to have war on every side, and sooner or later, you will become skilled at not letting your carnal mind overtake you without, you become skilled at doing it, in a godly spirit to the other person, and you will come to a place where you will not, at the beginning when you first start going through this, it is very upsetting, because you have a perception that wherever you turn people are trying to take authority over you, you feel like the whole world is against you, but you will learn as you experience this, you will become strengthened, the Lord will strengthen you, and you will learn to not take it personally, that is the number one lesson to not take it personally, why? Because these things must needs be.
As Christ appears in you, one of the signs that He is appearing in you is that everybody's carnal mind is going to try to kill them. Every carnal mind is going to try to counsel you, everyone's carnal mind is going to try and teach you, everyone's carnal mind is going to try and bring you into submission. It is part of the hazing brethren, it has to happen.
Do not get mad at the people that are doing it to you, they are just doing what God sent them to do, testing you. Your first challenge is to not get mad at the people, and the second challenge is to get strong and to just take it as a way of life, that is just the way it is, no point in getting mad, and then the Lord will teach you how to deal with these people, everyone does not come at you in the same way, the Lord will teach you how to deal with people who are given over to their carnal mind who do not even know what they are doing, who usually think that they are right in what they are doing, how to deal with them in love, and the love of God manifests in different ways, some people you could be gentle with, but some people you cannot be gentle with, you have to give them a sharp rebuke, and as long as it is coming out of Christ, it is acceptable, Christ does give sharp rebukes. You respond to the person in a accordance with what they are manifesting towards you.
All must be in the spirit of love. How do you know it is in the spirit of love, it has got to produce fruit. Even if you have to sharply rebuke somebody, then eventually repentance comes forth, and peace prevails, you know it was God. Now sometimes I have rebuked people that have gone out of my life and I have not seen them in years, that does not mean it was not Christ, sometimes they go forth because maybe they have a problem with pride or rebellion or whatever, they go forth and they have to go through their trials, so when you see someone five or ten years later, if you see that Christ is increased in them, you know that you were a rod along the way that gave them a stroke.
You really have to pray about it, because sometimes the fruit comes forth right away and sometimes it does not come forth right away. I pray about everything, every time I have an encounter with somebody, I say, Lord is there anything that you would tell me, I told you this the other night, give a critique, what can I do, what can I do better, what did I do wrong. I want to be a son of God, I am not fooling with the carnal mind. Everything is a teaching experience, and the ultimate goal is to do everything that needs to be done in the love of God, and do the very best that you can for that person. If they need a stroke, then you have to give them a stroke, but just make sure it is God, why? Because if it is your carnal mind you are going to get stricken back, you are going to get the stroke back.
I guess that is not so terrible if you realize that you made a mistake. Nothing is so terrible if you realize that you made a mistake and God shows you, you have to avoid it the next time. We are all involved in trial and error, we are all learning, we are not going to be robots with the Spirit of God just flowing through us without us having anything to do with it. We are going to be living thinking, breathing manifestations of the mind of Christ. That is what we are being trained for. That is what the imparted anointing is. We are not a fully formed ram that did not have the benefit of all his childhood experience, we are going to have all of the experiences that is to have, and when our minds are fully woven together with Christ, we will have all of the experiences that He ever had, in all of the prophets, and in all of the apostles, all that experience is going to be flowing through our mind, because mind will be our mind.
Can you imagine having all of that wisdom, and all that experience to draw upon? All of that understanding? What amazes me is when the Scripture says, When Jesus met the disciples on the road to Emmaus, and He expounded from the Scripture, all of the Scriptures talking about Christ, who here could do that, I would not even know where to find them, the Scripture says all of the Scriptures that prophesied Christ. The point was it was all in his head, it was all in his head.
COMMENT: What is your definition of a rebuke?
PASTOR VITALE: The word rebuke means criticism, so we have constructive criticism, and criticism that destroys. Constructive criticism will bring godly fruit, it will show you where you made an error and give you good solid suggestions as to how to do better, and if the person receives the correction, that means they are a wise son and they are going to grow from the experience. If they do not receive the correction, the Scripture says they are a foolish son, and there is nothing left for them but the rod.
COMMENT: The other day we were talking and I had said something to you about, I would not have handled it that way, you came back very quickly with, I will accept that rebuke, and I said, What rebuke, I was saying in my own mind, what rebuke? Because to me when Jesus, He rebuked the sea, to me He took authority over and a command to it, that is what it meant, it did not mean criticism to me.
PASTOR VITALE: No, a rebuke is a criticism, it is a sharp criticism.
COMMENT: A sharp criticism?
PASTOR VITALE: a sharp criticism, a strong criticism, it is not, you can say, Well you can beat around the bush, it depends on who you are dealing with. I could say to somebody, Look, I have something to say to you and I ask you to listen to me and I would like to point out something that you did, and in a way you could do it better. That is a correction and it is gentle, but some people it is necessary to stop them right on the spot, and that is a sharp rebuke.
COMMENT: If I give somebody my opinion I do not necessarily mean it as correction, maybe what is right for me is not necessarily right for them, I did not see it as a rebuke.
PASTOR VITALE: Well I do not remember what I said to you, but I want to tell you Xxxx that lots of times, you do not, you do things and your understanding does not line up with what you do. Sometimes it is very godly, what you do, but your understanding does not line up with what you do. It sort of like what we were talking about, Christ flowing through you but you do not have the understanding. I hear that a lot with you. That is something for you to be praying about, for Him to, see there is a separation, between, frequently between what you do and your understanding of it, and God has to close that gap.
COMMENT: It is just not my way to correct somebody else, I never thought, I always look into myself and what I am doing, because it is never my way to correct somebody else, I look at how I react and how I respond and what I thought about it, agreed or disagreed, but what they did was up to them.
PASTOR VITALE: Well maybe you are not aware that you are doing it.
COMMENT: And it was not what I did, until you responded, exactly how you took it. You accepted it, you said, I accept that rebuke, and I thought to myself, I did not give a rebuke.
PASTOR VITALE: Well I do not remember the conversation, but what I want to leave with you to pray about, is that there is a big separation between, frequently between what you do and your understanding of what you do, so it is just something to pray about, because you want to understand what you are doing. Sometimes it is, I am not saying it is all ungodly, sometimes it is very godly, it is important that you see what you do as Christ sees it, and there is like a wall between what you do and what you think.
COMMENT: For instance when we say, something happens, and say, I rebuke that. If there is a storm coming or something like that, what exactly are we doing, we are criticizing it?
PASTOR VITALE: You are criticizing it, you are saying, Turn around and go someplace else, you know, you have to, in order to criticize something in Christ, it has to be out of order, so that old order deliverance technique is saying, You have no right to be here, so in the name of Jesus I criticize your activities and turn you away, that is what it is saying. A rebuke is a correction.
COMMENT: Even in natural things.
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah, a rebuke is a correction. If your grandchild is in your house and they keep, for example you try to have a conversation with your husband and they keep interrupting, you turn around and you say, Now Xxxxxx, you are interrupting, wait until I finish talking. That is a rebuke.
COMMENT: You mean like for example if I had a conversation with someone and Christ wanted to speak to that person, Christ could just rise up in me and speak through me, my carnal mind cannot understand it?
PASTOR VITALE: Oh yes, it could go right past you, I have experienced that. Once it really frightened me, as a matter of fact it was one of those times that I was caught up very high, and I am of the opinion I was baptized in the Holy Spirit, it lasted for more than a week, and I had just been, I think it was like the second day, and there was a woman getting deliverance on the floor, she was very upset, and I went over to her, I knew God had sent me over, but I thought it was to pray for her, and as I approached her, the Lord spoke right out of my mouth and He spoke in the first person, He said to her, It is I, and It really shook me, and I went home and I did a big research on what a true prophet is, and the Lord showed me that a true prophet, now not the gift of prophecy in the church, but a true prophet frequently speaks in the first person, as if they were God, so I had a peace about it, but it really scared me. That day that caught me up to pray healing, and I stayed up for a whole week, I was running around rebuking people and I was really scared, I put myself down in my seat, I did not want to get out of my seat, it was one, I had rebuked, I shook my finger in my face. I said, Oh God, what is happening to me, I put myself in the seat in the church and I wanted to just sneak out of there, and as I started to leave, there was this same person, and I rebuked him again.
The next week, Hopkins came into the church, and I never saw anything like before or since, there was fire all over that man as he preached, and he, although he did not go to the individual person, he had the same word and he knew it was for somebody in the congregation, and a couple of weeks later, despite all of the warnings, this person did what they were warned not to do. It was God all of the way. I have not seen him, I have not seen him. A lot of people, they cannot perceive Christ when you do things like that. If you criticize somebody, if you shake your finger in their face, a lot of people in the church, they cannot even imagine that it could possibly be God, they think it is you. If anyone ever does that to you for your own sake, ask the Lord if it could not possibly be Him, because if it is Him you should want to receive whatever He has to say to you.
COMMENT: I am a person that cannot jump to conclusions, I have to sit back and evaluate, is that a lack of discernment, that discernment has to be, pop up like popcorn?
PASTOR VITALE: Well in the end times it is going to be necessary, but the Lord will bring it forth in you, you cannot force it, there is no way that you can force it, but it is necessary, and as we get more and more spiritual, to be able to try the spirit right on the spot, but it is something that you have to grow into, the Lord has to give it to you. Anybody else? You see ideally, what we are striving for, I have partially entered into it, it happens to me a lot, but not all of the time, is that the mind of Christ is so developed in you, that He is just right there dealing with the situation. It is not the spirit of God flowing through you like you are a robot, it is the mind of Christ that is becoming your personality, that is discerning spirits, that is dealing with problems, that has the answer right there on the spot, it is the new you, it is your inner man and it is different than the Spirit of God taking over, it is different.
As you live more and more out of Christ, He will be there as your reflex reaction. We all have reflex reactions in the carnal mind, everybody does. Somebody says something to you, most people you know will deal with it on the spot, if somebody says something aggressive to you, you got to deal with it someway, very few people will just turn around and walk away, you will say something back, that is a reflex reaction, and most of the time, for most of you, it would be your carnal mind, but as you learn to live out of Christ more and more, you will find it will be Christ rising up and the answers will be right there. It is just a growing up, that is what it is, it is a maturing in Christ, that is what you are being trained for here.
COMMENT: This will probably just take a minute or so. I looked the word up in the open Bible for rebuke, it says to reprimand sharply, and it says Jesus' power to restrain, one of the other titles in the Scripture, but it says, committed by God, designed for good, accomplished in love, and then it says, Rebuke for sin, manner of, before all, and then with long suffering, another one sharply, with all authority.
COMMENT: In John chapter 3:5 it says, Jesus answered, Verily, verily I say unto thee, except a man be born of water, and of the spirit, He cannot enter the kingdom of God. What is water, born of water mean.
PASTOR VITALE: This world system is water, it means this human birth is to be born of water.
COMMENT: Okay, so we are born into this world system and then born into the spiritual...
PASTOR VITALE: Realm of God through Christ.
COMMENT: Could it in verse 8 when it says, The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but cannot tell whence it cometh and whither it goeth, so is everyone that is born of the Spirit, is it talking about, the same thing that when a person gets pregnant, they get pregnant whenever God chooses.
PASTOR VITALE: I do not think so, I think what it is saying, is that when you are truly born of the spirit, now to be fully born of the spirit, you are in full stature, that you never know where you are going to be going. I have been telling you I have been experiencing that somewhat, it is not my whole life, but sometimes I wind up places and I do things that I do not know why I am doing them, and sometimes they look really strange.
To be born of the spirit and you get blown, you do not know which way you are getting blown, that means that you are not choosing which direction you are going in, but the Spirit within you is controlling your behavior, where you are going, what you are doing, and what you are saying. It is not you controlling your own life anymore. The wind, meaning the spirit, the spirit blows you, or the spirit directs you, where you are going to go.
COMMENT: So when I meet up with these carnal Christians, I tell them well I am going where the Lord leads me, and they start quoting Scriptures, but the Bible says this, the Bible says that, I am saying, Oh, I am just going where the Spirit leads me. Well he said God could do anything He wants, could He speak outside of His word?
PASTOR VITALE: He breaks His own law all of the time. That is why we must come to a place where we can discern His Spirit because the Spirit of God breaks the laws of this world system, and He does it, and if it is His Spirit doing it, there is no law against it.
COMMENT: Yeah, but the Lord is not going to say, Well go have commit adultery with that person because it is in Christ.
PASTOR VITALE: No, He is not going to do that.
COMMENT: Or go have sex with that person, fornication and say, Well you know, there is line, I mean you know this sounds ridiculous, but you could say, it looked like a lie what Jesus said, but a lie is a lie, well sex is sex right? So there has got to be line somewhere.
PASTOR VITALE: Yeah, I cannot tell you where it is. Well it is there, I mean I cannot believe that. Let us put it this way, there has to be fruit. Now, how could there be any positive fruit from committing adultery or fornication, no I cannot believe that, but like for example the man who wrote the book, He was God's smuggler, he broke the laws of Russia, but he got Bibles into all of those people, there has to be fruit, there has to be fruit. That is a good point, because adultery is really more than a physical law, it is a spiritual law to commit adultery, it is breaking a spiritual law, but he broke the man made laws that is true.
COMMENT: Well lying is a spiritual law.
PASTOR VITALE: Lying is a spiritual law. All that I could tell you is that if it came out of Christ, it was okay, I am telling you the line is really blurry.
COMMENT: Did Jesus mean there, No, I am not going up with YOU to the feast, and then he just did not finish it.
PASTOR VITALE: It says He went up in secret after that, it says He went up in secret, He did not want them to know that He was there.
COMMENT: But did He tell them, I am not going at all? Is that what He meant in the Scriptures?
PASTOR VITALE: That is what He said, He said, I am not going, and then He went in secret.
COMMENT: Could he have said something and then changed his mind, maybe at that moment He said, Well I am not going, and then decided to...
PASTOR VITALE: Well then He would not have gone in secret, He would have gone up and said, Hey fellows, guess what I changed my mind. He went in secret.
COMMENT: Could he have gone being in secret that no one could see Him go, and no one would know that He was there, could He have meant there, you know, invisible.
PASTOR VITALE: He told them He was not going and then He went in secret, told them He was not going and then He went in secret, that is what it says.
COMMENT: So they possibly saw Him then at the feast?
PASTOR VITALE: I do not know, I have no idea.
COMMENT: Well that is what I am questioning, did He go in secret and was He invisible while there, they did not see Him there at all.
PASTOR VITALE: Here it is, it is John 7, Go ye up unto this feast, I go not up yet unto this feast, for my time is not yet full come. When He had said these words unto them, He abode still in Galilee, but when His brethren were gone up, then He went up also unto the feast, not openly, but as it were in secret. Yeah, but you know, you have to look at it in the Greek, He said, my time is not yet come, He says I am not going, but it says that the brethren who wanted Him to go, that He perceived that their motives were ungodly. He did this because their motives for wanting Him to go were ungodly. Therefore, in righteousness, I do not understand it completely, but in righteousness, He would not go with them. He could that in righteousness. He was beyond that law because He knew that they were trying to seduce them into something ungodly.
Even if He did say to them, I go not up yet, because my time is not yet come, that would not mean to me, I am going five minutes later, would that mean to you that He is going five minutes later? No, He says I am not going with you now, maybe next year I am going to go, I am not going now.
COMMENT: He says in verse 10, very interesting, But when His brethren were gone up, then went He also up unto the feast, not openly but as it were in secret. And everybody is expecting Jesus to come back to this earth and see Him walking around, and it is like He is coming secretly in the sons of God.
PASTOR VITALE: Right, and the people who cannot discern it, they are not going to believe it.
COMMENT: And look at verse 11, Then the Jews sought Him at the feast and said, Where is He? They are not going to know, and they are going to question, where is He? The murmuring going on.
PASTOR VITALE: Now listen to this, when He was up there, because they did not know He was there, they were talking about Him, because they did not know He was there, they felt free to speak things that were in their heart that were exposed. They had some ungodly plan there. It says brethren, I do not know, I think it was His natural brethren, but I am not sure. It was the feast of tabernacles.
COMMENT: If His natural family wanted to force Him to go to expose Him, that is just like the natural family, the carnal mind, the carnal mind wants you exposed.